greta thunberg has like 30 minutes until she gets called a tankie

Having met Greta through our respective autism support communities, it feels weird that I still think of her as a kid. She can buy alcohol now!

I had a good feeling she'd end up a comrade.

She's been able to buy alcohol for three years

Yeah I've heard good things about her from people who have met her too, glad to see it reflected here

She's amazing.

Has she ever pointed out that the main economic reason that the US needs Israel is to destabilize Middle Eastern countries with large oil reserves? I think that's a really powerful argument for her audience and I'm a little sad not to see her explain that connection here.

Honestly, I'm glad to see a change. For all my life, I've heard "oil oil oil" behind every US action, and while that might be part of the thing, it's far from the whole picture and her tweet calling imperialism by its name is kinda what we need if you ask me
- True, but imperialism is a pretty abstract concept and a general audience always does better to understand what it means concretely. Most people think imperialism means any kind of military conflict between a big country and a small country, not the monopoly stage of capitalism.

There is no doubt that one of the candidates - Trump - is way more dangerous than the other

In no way judging Greta here, but I have doubts

Dick Cheney scares me far more than Donald Trump does. Cheney has caused far more death and destruction, and is much more effective in his evil deeds. When both candidates are pro-war and genocide, I think the side with Dick Cheney’s endorsement scares me more.

This is compounded by the fact that Republicans face more opposition than Democrats when they do evil things, and Trump more than the average Republican. Do you think the George Floyd protests would’ve been nearly as big if Biden had been president at the time? Absolutely not. Both at an institutional and public level, Trump, by nature of being icky, pisses people off and it makes his schemes harder to pull off. When Biden does the exact same things, he does them to thunderous applause.

Roe was overturned under Biden. More people have been deported by Biden. Biden ended covid protections, and more people have died from covid because of him. And most importantly, Biden is the architect of the Gazan genocide.

I’ve said before that voting for Kamala over Trump is voting to re-elect Hitler to prevent Goebbels from getting into office, but I’m starting to think it’s more like voting for Hitler to prevent Kaiser Wilhelm from getting back into office. Like yeah, he sucked dick and did a bunch of evil shit, but Hitler is currently doing the Holocaust.

I don't really get the idea that people are somehow going to be 'more against' the genocide in Gaza because Trump is in office. Sure, people protested for George Floyd. You know what they didn't protest at all? The killing of Soleimani. In fact I can't think of a single foreign policy initiative that liberals protested other than the visit with Kim Jong-Un, the only good foreign policy thing that Trump did during his presidency.
The people that are currently protesting the Gaza genocide will continue to protest no matter who is in office. The people who are not are not going to have some sort of come to Jesus moment because the cheeto got elected.
- The killing of Soleimani. In fact I can't think of a single foreign policy initiative that liberals protested other than the visit with Kim Jong-Un, the only good foreign policy thing that Trump did during his presidency.
  yes
  glory DPRK
- If history is any guide, at best they’ll protest the procedure of Trump’s support of the genocide. Trump won’t follow some meaningless rubber stamping process of the shipping of arms to Israel and then the libs will say “this is wrong we’re against this” but not because of the genocide but because Trump didn’t follow the by-laws of supporting a genocide.
- Oh yeah to be clear I do not think it will change the math on Gaza that much. I meant all of the issues generally, but immigration is the main one I think Trump is actually the lesser evil on.
  Biden deported more people than Trump. They’ve managed to actually implement Trump’s immigration policy, which when Trump attempted to do he was unable to, due to opposition from both Dem politicians and the general public. I think Dems have greater freedom to be strict on immigration than Republicans do, because when Dems do it everyone falls in line.
- The war is gonna escalate, and under Trump the liberal media is gonna be allowed to criticize his handling (under Biden they aren't allowed). That's enough for quite a lot more Gen X and millenials who get their news from the TV or from the NYT to feel a leftwards push.
- People were going mad about kids in cages too, and the drone bombings for a little while. Not to mention civil rights. But yeah the one time he was "presidential" was when he dropped a big bomb in the middle east.
  I still think he's better though, but that's because he's a buffoon and an isolationist. I think we'd still be in Afghanistan if it hadn't been for him
- The people that are currently protesting the Gaza genocide will continue to protest no matter who is in office.
  Absolutely, but Trump will spend more time demonizing them as antisemitic terrorist supporters. He's always been rabidly zionist and has always loved using leftist grassroots movements as a bogeyman, he's not gonna pass that opportunity up. Idk if that would translate into more actual repression against them, but islamophobia dressed up as fighting terrorism traditionally has a lot of traction in the US, and i do not see the Dems pushing back against that even if they would control both houses after the midterms, genocide support is a bipartisan issue after all and they will falter when Trump links the Dems to the protests like he did with BLM. It's also possible that Trump lays the ideological groundwork for more effective anti-left policies under a Dem presidency from 2028-2032. He's good at normalizing atrocities, and the Dems have shown to be eager to then implement that (see also: deportations and the Dems bragging about how they actually built the wall that Trump promised). There can absolutely be a ratchet effect in this regard.
  I could also see Trump being more supportive of the genocide itself. More bombs, more open endorsement, more troops on the ground. Biden has already sent missile defense crews there, i think this still has potential for escalation, as hard as that is to imagine for many people here.
  Mind you, i'm not doing a lesser evilism here, it's the morally correct choice not to pick between hand-wringing and enthusiastic genocide, but to treat this as a line that can't be crossed either way. But it's absolutely possible that things will get worse in this regard under Trump.
I agree. I think the main type of people who think Trump is worse than Biden/Kamala just dont want to see the huge power of imperialism focused back in on itself. Theyre a kind of racist chauvinist that doesnt value the lives of brown people anywhere else unless they are here.
- 100%. This is the attitude of 90% of Americans. It’s exceptionalism all the way down.
True, the side with the backing of the deep state is always the most dangerous in imperialist states.
he does them to thunderous applause
- That was what I was thinking of lmao
In the comparing of candidates. I feel like it not that deep. Like there is something very viscerally repellent about the manifestation of Cristo fascism on the American right.
Like I think of the liberal canard of 99% Hitler retoric and like my rejection of it is on the basis that I wont vote for any% Hitler rather than the premise that they are equal. Idk maybe this is a vestige of my liberalism.
- See, I’m not above voting for the lesser Hitler. If I felt confident that Kamala would lead to solidly less-bad outcomes, I would go vote for her.
I don't think either Kamala or Trump believe in much of anything but I do think the Republicans are straight-up cartoon villains and more evil than the Dems. Not because the Dems are good, they're horrible, the Republicans are just that comically vile.
- I do believe the republicans are more evil, but I also think they’re a less competent evil that by being so comical provokes a lot of pushback.
  The Republicans aim to do 100% evil and only manage to do 75%, the Democrats aim for 90% evil and succeed.

Light itself, but like, unironically

Well, the autism is a bit of a boost in actually getting to the root of the problem rather than getting stuck in the neurotypical bounds of respectability and milque toast solutions.
Malala became the worst sellout and Greta became an actual activist.
I never thought that would be the case, but hindsight is 20/20.
- Wait what happened with Malala?
- Malala
  idk who she is ,how did she sell out ?

Greta progressively getting more based is fun to see, maybe the kids are alright?

As a youth who realized I’m mostly so based (and scarcely compared to her) because this area is my autistic special interest, I’m afraid we’re in a similar boat as non-representatives. Still, I remain hopeful and we are slowly radicalizing as conditions worsen.
- I have noticed that many people who are disabled (such as myself who is AuDHD) or GSM/trans are usually the first to be radicalized as MLs (or at least anarchists).
I'm the same age as Greta, and she was a massive inspiration to me when she started. I was a communist first but she has done massive amounts of good, getting young people invested in climate change action, and also seeing how useless liberal protest is
- Oh, absolutely, she's always been a great vector for radicalization for the youth, and her continued growth has only helped.

Waiting for the inevitable "Greta is a Russian assett" think piece.

Or in a more infantilizing way "Has been influenced by Russian propaganda"

Greta start posting on hexbear

She's not enough of a
to post here
- Yeah, she'll be on Lemmygrad calling Dessalines a reactionary

Greta Thunberg isn't even an American lol
sitting this election out by voting third party
Voting is actually not voting you see, but also not voting is actually voting
Incredible, all of the
lib talking points, complete with a promise to stand by and watch
- Someone in the replies called her a selfish white supremacist and got (as of now) 34 likes for it. Her copey ass response to it got much less than that, so that's something.
This is why I say the two parties are american-supremacists vs white-supremacists.
This person fundamentally believes that american lives are more important and valuable than anyone else's lives around the world. They are an american-supremacist without self-awareness.
- I'm pretty sure they're both just white supremacist parties.
- Auto-Crypto-Fascism is the default ideology in america. They all tell themselves they are "decent people who want liberty, equality and justice for all... but only if you are a legal citizen... and not ~~black~~ imean _{a criminal}~ umm poor." They recognize the horrific things done by their ancestors and the systems that their ancestors built but they refuse to right the wrongs or change the systems that continue to perpetrate those same racist colonial crimes.
  They are fascists that don't just hide it from others, they can't even recognize it about themselves.
She literally conceded in the fucking essay
That font plus light mode causes me physical pain lol
- The font is based, so you definitely have bad taste. (Good rhyme!)
  I used to use dark mode, but I switched to light mode on both my PC and phone because my main room light doesn't work anymore, so it helps give added brightness when I need it, and that's a lot more often without my light now.
sitting this election out by voting third party
Voting is actually not voting you see, but also not voting is actually voting
Link the comment, I want to see the replies
Link the comment. I want to @ her

I live in sweden and the divide on Greta is hilarious. On one hand you have reactionaries who STILL put stickers like "fuck you greta!" on their shitty cars, on the other you have lib climate activists who seem downright scared of her more based activism and talk about her "having gone too far" in hushed voices. Only ppl I've met that like her now are either MLs or hardcore anarchists. Imagine if she would join a marxist org

How does one 23 year old with no army "go too far"?
Libs.
- Libs are absolutely terrified of people saying stuff cause they think power is exchanged via west wing speeches
- It's the mirror image of the reactionary "this kind of activism only pushes people away"
- Well you see it's actually words and ideas that change the world <- Liberal ideology
  Which is why we should let nazis say whatever they want, to demonstrate the strength of the concept of freedom of speech <- Also liberal ideology
  But leftists need to shut the fuck up <- Still liberal ideology
Lmao everyone around me says her parents forced her to do activism and she's a fake. Real quiet now that the media has shut up about her because she criticizes the system.
I admit I am sceptical about her. She has this "trying to sell out" vibe, but I guess the ruling class doesn't actually care to buy her loyalty.
- I am all about kill your heroes etc, so I don't follow her and only hear about her every few months, and while I am always positively surprised, she wouldn't be the first to take a nose dive at a moment's notice. At the same time, I don't think she's actually trying to sell out, her shit is extremely unsellable ever since she dropped the lib "school strike" and went in with more hardcore activism. I think she might be genuine, and I say that as somebody who thought she was just a preppy kid back during her strike years (she comes from a well-off family etc).
- She could have sold out for millions long ago. Now the media try to keep a gag on her. She's too far gone for them to buy her out.

Shit, Hexbear is old. I remember people here discussing how we shouldn't be too critical of her because she was still a child. Now she's a young woman and we still shouldn't be too critical of her because she's right. I hope the rest of the generation tries to emulate it.

It's good that we were right about her longterm trajectory though!

If this keeps up we might get a Part 3 to this meme.

Btw the similar thing is in Polish, "postawić kogoś pod murem", literally "put someone against the wall" does not mean execution (unless the context is clear) but normally it is used as "someone is forced to decide/make hard choice".

I had her written off, but I'm down with Tankie Greta

I was like kid Greta as kid, but then turned into a lib as I got older. Glad she didn't make that mistake.

Marx's strongest marine (cause boats?)

what if greta was one of us

Invite her to hexbear and crash the site lol
- :dprksoldier: but it's Greta and it's not bandwidth but because she's pulled the plug on the server for using too much energy.
We need to get her on here to give hexbear some starpower. Imagine the malding from libs, though our poor mods would have to pull shock worker shifts taking out the trash
Just a slob like one of us

The Greta arc hasn't been as dramatic as the Daou arc but I'm still here for it

I'm voting Sinwar-Thunberg.

She's a good kid, giving me hope for the future.

~~164~~ 200+ comments? Did the dumbass libs find this post or are we having a struggle sesh about Greta?

::: spoiler predictions for if it's libs

More than one person thinking they're "as far left as they come" and therefore assume we must be Trump supporters if we hate Harris. Will result in some comment like "your boy Drump"
The trolley problem from a person who has already had it explained to them how it's not a trolley problem if they're both equally shit, just because they keep saying Harris' isn't as shit
The trolley problem again.
The trolley problem again.
Following these last few days, no libs will engage with the people pointing out how Harris is as bad as trump
"Voting for third party is wasted"
Voter fraud (By not voting for Harris I am voting for Trump, by not voting for Trump I am voting for Harris, letting me vote two times)
"The genocide would be worse!"
One person admitting by accident they are fine with palestinians being genocided
Just immense amounts of long-ago debunked propaganda
:::

::: spoiler predictions for strugglesesh

"Revisionism"
More PPB deployed than if it had been libs (no way to know, but you can feel it if it happens)
She's hiding her power levels vs. she's not hiding her powerlevels
Devolving into another barely related struggle session
A bad joke about scandinavia
People talking past each other, one side focusing on what good she does, the other focusing on it not being at all enough to

:::

edit:
It was the libs.
A little primer for triggered libs:

"The genocide would be worse!"
Okay, I'll be the lib...
I haven't seen much follow up coverag, maybe this was a rumor. Apparently Trump has promised Adelson's widow a full on support for annexation of the west bank. That seems... Not good. But also not much different than current policy. Idk, anybody know anything about this?
- The thing about genocide is that the end point is extermination. The number is the same.
  Palestinians are being put in concentration camps right now. Kamala has promised to support more than Biden, she's just smart enough not to go out and say all the ghoulish shit.
- If the farthest Israel is willing to go is x, both candidates will tell Bibi "why not x + 1?"

It's a welcome change, but she still isn't firm enough. To make her message more firm:

The first paragraph needs to be taken out. You can't say voting is pointless (true) while hyping up this election at the same time.
"There is no doubt that one of the candidates - Trump - is way more dangerous than the other." That's just her capitulating to lesser-evilers. Trump isn't "way more dangerous" than Harris at all outside of him being a shittier imperialist to the imperialist project. As Black revolutionary Imam Jamil Al-Amin said, "Evil is evil. There's nothing in between that."
"With this in mind, my main message to Americans is to remember that you cannot only settle for the least worst option." She needs to get rid of the "only."

To me, it looks like either her original message was a lot firmer but got watered down by one of her close associates who changed her mind/edited the message or she is personally conflicted and hasn't fully crossed the bridge to give up on lesser-evilism.

A famous activist going through the lib to leftist pipeline before our eyes is a good thing. It doesn't happen all at once.

A label I hope she'll embrace if she ever gets called that.

More like 30 seconds, from the moment they get to "USA - a country built on stolen land and genocide on indigenous people - will still be an imperialist, hyper-capitalist world power". Good take overall, way better than i expected.

Hell yeah, Greta

extremely common greta w

Greta is going for the twin towers

Gretanky

smh what's all these libs doing brigading on our thread? And they're so rude and condescending! Don't they know their ideology has never worked? It always collapses into fascism!

Greta vs Vivian Wilson

Who is more based all the time?

Is Vivian based or is she a lib?
- Good question I don't know, she is American so at least 70% of chance to be a lib.
  But the dickhead said: "It's full-on communism ... and a general sentiment that if you're rich, you're evil", not much evidence, everything wrong in the world is communism's fault, but maybe he is right that one time in his life.

My impression of what she's saying here is, vote for Harris now, but don't wait 4 years to be politically active again so we can try to actually get someone better. Which I completely agree with. Getting Trump elected doesn't help anything and might make some goals less achievable, and right now Harris is the only one who can beat him. But the more important part is to not stop critiquing her ideology. Don't let her forget about Palestinian children, don't let people be complacent with capitalist hegemony, do the ground work necessary to move our government to the left. That doesn't mean waiting four years to try and stop her reelection, it means continuing to talk in real life with people about what we should expect from government. It means trying to build momentum behind some candidates to get them elected in 2 years, and don't wait for election season to do so. This work doesn't stop.

And a brief aside for those that just want a revolution to be done with it. 1, most of the same still applies, especially the building momentum part. And 2, there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power, so we'll need to elect some sympathetic candidates before that possibility has any chance.

vote for Harris now
I will not endorse genocide
- I'm imposing my own interpretation onto her message, but I believe that someone aligned with Greta's message would see this is an absolutely reasonable position. That message reads to me like someone much more concerned with the cessation of genocide, capitalism, and climate catastrophe than who you vote for. If we read her message and started a big Harris v Trump debate I doubt Greta would be like "Finally! They understand and are reacting just the way I had intended!"
there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power
Gonna need some examples of what you’re talking about here
- The RRSDLP won 14 out of 442 seats in the 1912 election, maybe they mean that! (lol)
- Sankara was appointed Minister of Information in Saye Zerbo's military government in September 1981.
  After a coup (7 November 1982) brought to power Major-Doctor Jean-Baptiste Ouédraogo, Sankara became Prime Minister in January 1983. But he was dismissed a few months later, on 17 May.
  A coup d'état organized by Blaise Compaoré made Sankara President on 4 August 1983 at the age of 33
  See? There are many examples!
- That's now how that works. Please show me some examples of successful revolutions that had 0 ties to those in power.
This is a horribly out of touch reading on her directly calling out the US as a settler-colonial genocidal Empire. When she says Democracy is an every day thing, she isn't talking about trying to elect "good democrats," she directly tells the reader to Get Organized!
And a brief aside for those that just want a revolution to be done with it. 1, most of the same still applies, especially the building momentum part. And 2, there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power, so we'll need to elect some sympathetic candidates before that possibility has any chance.
Yes, organizing is critical, that's why she said to do so.
This is wrong on 2 fronts. The first, is the idea that successful revolutions have relied on the ruling class. This is false! From the Cuban, Chinese, Russian, Korean, to the Vietnamese, and beyond, working class revolutions have been the only truly successful revolutions. Secondly, there will never be establishment candidates symathetic to overthrowing the system they rose to power in.
Read The State and Revolution. The bourgeois state cannot be overthrown from above, it must be smashed from below.
it means continuing to talk in real life with people about what we should expect from government.
Your government must be eradicated
so we'll need to elect some sympathetic candidates before that possibility has any chance.
My impression of what she's saying here is, vote for Harris now
Lol, vote brain
And a brief aside for those that just want a revolution to be done with it. 1, most of the same still applies, especially the building momentum part. And 2, there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power, so we'll need to elect some sympathetic candidates before that possibility has any chance.
lol
- the history understander has logged on
vote for Harris now
nowhere did she imply that
- There is no doubt one of the candidates - Trump - is way more dangerous than the other.
  Both recognizes those are the only 2 real options, and directly states which is the worse of those 2 options.
  you cannot only settle for the least worst option
  Implying you do need to settle for the least worst option but going on to say that that's not enough to actually make change.
Which sympathetic candidates are you thinking of?
- The offices where we actually have a chance of electing someone in the next 2 years are all local positions. So that answer is going to be dependent on what state you live in.
Hi person from lemmy
My power level is to high for you to even imagine
so these are the libs from lemmy you guys told me about
- They get much dumber than this. There's an aura of smug dipshittery surrounding them but they're lacking some really horrendous vibes that can best be illustrated like so:
wow the old :vote: and then push dems left argument huh
My impression of what she's saying here is, vote for Harris now
No? Lol. She does not say to vote at all. She says they're both evil genocidal pieces of shit.
and right now Harris is the only one who can beat him
Who gives a fuck
But the more important part is to not stop critiquing her ideology. Don't let her forget about Palestinian children, don't let people be complacent with capitalist hegemony, do the ground work necessary to move our government to the left.
"WE CAN PUSH THEM LEFT"
Lmao are you people seriously saying this AGAIN? How many elections in a row are you going to say this nonsense and be proven wrong over and over again? Fuck off. You can't push ANYTHING in the american democratic system other than what the bourgeoisie want. Average people have ZERO impact on policy, fact, studied and proven.
It means trying to build momentum behind some candidates to get them elected in 2 years
lol in 2 and 4 years you will be screeching to vote liberal again because you have absolutely no commitment to building the future now.
And a brief aside for those that just want a revolution to be done with it.
You're talking about this entire instance.
1, most of the same still applies, especially the building momentum part.
No it does not. Because you are talking about electoralism, which is not remotely the same thing. Revolutions are not built by winning elections lmao.
And 2, there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power
Absolutely false lol
- The only "connection to those in power" a successful revolution has is a noose.
- "WE CAN PUSH THEM LEFT"
  Lmao are you people seriously saying this AGAIN? How many elections in a row are you going to say this nonsense and be proven wrong over and over again?
  They've been saying it for over half a century. In some ways since the 1800's. Luckily for the dems, libs have the memory of a housefly
My impression of what she's saying here is
Liberals and talking over marginalised people, name a more iconic duo
And a brief aside for those that just want a revolution to be done with it. 1, most of the same still applies, especially the building momentum part. And 2, there haven't been any successful revolutions without some connections to those in power, so we'll need to elect some sympathetic candidates before that possibility has any chance.
At this point low-information uneducated liberals attempting to lecture Marxist-Leninists on revolution stops being frustrating and starts being funny.

Fascism is already here, it just isn't happening to you yet
We already have fascism now, we're genociding Palestine now, we have children in cages on the border now
Why is every dbzero user so infected by liberalism
- Infected by liberalism is hilarious considering who I am. Thanks for the chuckle.
You are an american-supremacist without self-awareness. You believe that your lives are more important than other lives in the world. Your opposition are white-supremacists with self-awareness.
The lack of the awareness that you're a supremacist is what allows you to convince yourself you are a good person compared to the other supremacists.
And the choice is between fascism now or fascism later (maybe)
The only reason you believe this is because you don't think the 2million lives that america has murdered abroad every decade since ww2 matter. In your heart it is only fascism if it happens in america.
You are a nationalist and a supremacist, you just don't realise it.
So that butchering of Palestinians now is not fascism yet? Or the mass deportations? Christ what would it take for something to be fascist other than an R next to the person doing it's name?
Also who is this "we"? There is no way to buy time for the people being exterminated. You are not buying time for the people being left to die in the face of natural disasters. You are not buying time for the hundreds of thousands of minorities who's lives are destroyed by law and order democrats.
I’m sorry about the unwarranted dogpiling that’s being done to you in this thread. I hope you’ll understand that this instance has a handful of loud users, that don’t represent the majority. We’re a couple of users and mods who have recently started actively trying to improve the culture of the site, and summed up our mission in a short document we call the Posting Policy Bulletin which I hope should give you some pause. It’s still a mission in progress and we make compromises daily, but for now we have adults in the room making hard decisions!
- Lmao I almost forgot our posting policy and I was about to yell at you. So really glad you posted this reminder.
What do you think fascism is? Where does it come from?
- Fascism is when there’s a got dang cheeto in the White House
Fascism now - Kamala
Fascism later (maybe) - Trump
No the second system is imperialism
Fake democracy isnt a system its a distraction show
Read Fascism and Big Business by Daniel Guerin