It turns out one of my friends is a pro-Ukraine leftist type

inb4 he reluctantly admits azov is just out-and-out fash, but then immediately shifts goalpost to "ok but there's a big fash problem in the russian army too, you know" (aka the 'my dad')

Already did, but apparently the far right isn't a big problem because they're not winning elections or something
- The right wing, famous for meekly accepting election losses
- lol what elections?
- I guess Zelensky suspending elections is a pretty good way to not lose any
- They (literally in this case) hold a gun to the government in Ukraine. They don't need to win any elections, they just need to ban all left wing opposition in the name of anti-collaboration (done) and then wait for the liberals to fuck everything up (happening), then come into power on a stabbed in the back myth.
  Edit: The only way this doesn't happen is if Russia literally kills most of them, and even then, that will not stop the sons and daughters of these nationalists from repeating the same refrains as their mothers and fathers. The only fortunate thing is that the conscription age is still not under 27, so we are not yet seeing literal children being sent to die in this war like near the end of WWI. However, that does lead me to the idea that these new Ukrainian nationalists will not be hardened enough to take the government by force. They will be the soft children of American compradors, claiming the west stabbed them in the back while campaigning using western funding.
I just saynthat Johm Wick killed all those guys
Pic related
Putin blew up Prigo's plane and libs still run with this narrative lol
The whataboutism strategy
- whataboutism
I understand not supporting Ukraine due to it for example banning leftist opposition parties, removing rights for minority languages, fascists in the military etc. But I also see a lot of people actively cheering on and supporting Russia which I dont understand. Is a reactionary dictatorship really preferred to neoliberalism?
I also understand its horrible that the west is using the Ukrainian people as a meat grinder to occupy and weaken Russia, but would a Russian invasion and russification be much better?
I feel like we need to be better than just contrarian, though I cant honestly decide which is best or least worse.
- Is a reactionary dictatorship really preferred to neoliberalism
  Ukraine is a fascist neo nazi dictatorship, russia is preferred.
  We're communists here, heres how marx viewed inter bourgeoisie conflicts
  'In that house one never hesitated to take a stand against the conflicts in which one could recognize "the different fractions of the bourgeoisie." Neutrality was abhorred. [...] Marx hunted neutral souls to the gates of hell'
  (machine translated) from "Gespräche mit Marx und Engels", section writte by Charles Longuet, Marx's son in law
  Most people here consider russia to be the lesser of two evils, since it generally does not fill itself with nazi iconography, does not ally with the united states, and does not persecute national minorities to any extent like ukraine does
- Russia has elections and political parties and separation of powers, it is no more of a 'dictatorship' than the USA or any european country.

Meanwhile on r/NonCredibleDefense:

It turns out one of my friends is Putler shill Tankie type
Shouldn't have said anything, now I'm getting paragraphs upon paragraphs about ZelenSSkyy and how Putler has a moral obligation to eradicate the freedom loving Azov Slavas in Ukraine

Ask them if the leftist position is to set alight trade union buildings with people in them.

TBH that's annoying but not a huge deal. It's a pretty standard opinion if you have no history education (99% of Americans).
Now, if they're also pro-Israel...

They see Russia and Israel as the greatest threats to world peace. I'm just kicking myself for saying anything at all about the Ukrainian military and their love for ~~Nazi iconography~~ ~~esoteric occult symbols~~ traditional Slavic imagery. I have no interest in litigating this shit

Ukraine is the true litmus test for leftists when it comes to international geopolitics.

You will really find out which of those who call themselves leftists will be the ones doing the bidding for imperialists when revolutions finally arrive at the imperial core.

One of the most interesting observations that this whole Ukraine war revealed is just how stark the difference in position is between leftists in the imperial core versus leftists in the Global South. The vast majority of the latter immediately recognized why Russia is on the correct side of the history, while the former spent months arguing and failing to understand how imperialism works.

It’s almost like victims of abusers can immediately recognize abusive behavior in others, while abusers themselves keep failing to understand, “how is this an abuse? she hit me first!”. That doesn’t mean victims can’t be shitty themselves, but it certainly doesn’t make them less of a victim of abuse.

Even most countries that do not have a left wing government, let alone AES, stood with Russia and refused to participate while the Western imperialists asked them to sanction Russia. It is truly one of those times when the Global South finally stood up against their imperialist oppressors and refused to do their bidding.

OP, you are from the imperial core, I suppose?

Idk, I think gaza is a better litmus test. You can easily be misinformed about Ukraine being good.
I think it's harder for leftists to get Gaza wrong.
- This is why Ukraine is the litmus test. Even libs could see the genocide taking place in Gaza.
  But to understand the Ukraine war, you really need to understand how imperialism works, not the lib definition of “conquering a foreign territory”.
- It's a litmus test for whether someone's views on geopolitics be taken seriously, not a moral purity test. Someone can be a good person and be wrong about Ukraine, that only partly overlaps with having good politics.
- Also, genocide in Gaza has resulted in the countries going against it, in ICJ, I don't remember seeing anything similar about the war in Ukraine
I thought the general opinion was that of indifference, rather than explicit support? I didn't research this well, so I would like to get more info.
- It takes more than indifference for Global South countries to stand up to Western imperialism, especially against the US which controls the global access to dollar and to trade.
- General opinion among which groups? If you investigate you'll find out how specific it really is.

Here's why your friend is a.misguided fool and feel free to use this: as a leftist your interest when war between two bourgeois powers go to war is primarily to minimize the amount of working class people being killed because they are the clas you're attempting to uphold. This means that the war and therefore killing ending earlier is better so aside from not having a war in the first place the fastest route to peace is the best route. In this case that is Ukraine's surrender, doesn't need to be unconditional and could probably have been more conditional earlier but at the end of the day every way ends at the negotiation table and Ukraine's power at that table has only lessened.

He believes Russians will [CW: SV] ::: spoiler spoiler rape ::: and massacre Ukrainians en masse if they win. He also believes that if Putin isn't taught a lesson now the Russians will do the same to other neighboring states next, because they're monstrously evil barbarians apparently
- Yeah this is just racism where Russians don't get to be white anymore.
- Hmm, I don't hang out with people who are like this. My friends are leftists and know wassup and my co-eorkers and acquaintances are politically ignorant as hell but have the humility to believe what I tell em cause I can explain history good. If someone does have those views they keep it to themselves around me because I don't suffer bullshit like that and will give someone a really really long lecture.
They heard that one and invented a take that "Putler wants to genocide and destroy all Ukranians" which is obvious nonsense give even UN put the military to civilian losses ratio in the war as something like 50 to 1 meaning it's probably the most restrained major conflict since the dawn of industrial warfare.

All of you may die, but that is a sacrifice I have a moral obligation to make

It's a common baby leftist failing. Think about how many supported the libyan colour revolt uncritically, or the white hats and us aligned militias in Syria. Manufactured consent is powerful.

Of course in both cases there there were active independent socialist militias, and it's hard not to have had an idealist desire to see the DCNS win. But we should have had better material analysis.

In Ukraine it's chuds vs open fascists with an increasingly strained liberal comedian facade and the poor bastards of the Donbass republics in the middle.

I sympathise with your friend, I dearly want to see Putin get the wall but this is clearly a US destabilisation and more critically the concept of a Banderan Fascist state on the border of the EU should terrify Liberals as well far more than any Russian hegemony over its historic sphere.

It's a common baby leftist failing
Uhhh huhhhhh sure
Think about how many supported the libyan colour revolt uncritically
Oh that kind of leftist, ic wym
Yeah I can go back and easily dig up Zizek shitting on anti-war protestors during Iraq and yet people here paraded him around along with the rest of the worst philosophers of the 20th century to feel smart until he said something obviously transphobic.
- Well you know as much as I hate to say it, I think Norm Finkelstein published an unhinged transphobic essay on his blog or whatever the hell too. Not defending Zizek but just pointing out how this can happen from time to time.

Where do they fall on this chart?

Upper-left quadrant
- There are worse things to be, that's for sure

Gotta love leftists measuring importance of a movement based on electoral success. Fucking social fascists dude

Unhinge your jaw and consume them. Later, as they fall into the toilet, they will be born anew as a hexbearian poster

No, they gotta be vored by a Pig. Said Pig will then shit them out as Poop onto their Balls, in the holy Pig Poop Balls ritual. Only then they'll become a true Hexbearian

Same. My friend keeps dropping takes like "did you know that Russian soldiers are all drugged beyond belief to get them fighting" or "Russians torture the people just like Israel does". For me they are just these lines here and there that make me think he is following some very propagandy channels somewhere, but I refuse to engage with him and instead just sort of brush over these takes.

But I have wondered where they are coming from. I am not saying bad things aren't done during war, but these seem sus.

I'm glad the American military doesn't have a drug problem
- The Fort Formerly known as Bragg:
Im sure they're hopped on amphetamines but that's because every single army in a protracted war since fucking Crimea has shived uppers at their soldiers.
The same playbook recycled over and over.
They reused the "they're giving soldiers viagra with the explicit purpose of them SAing people" that that used for Libya.

Your moral obligation is to ask him if he's pissing and shidding and crying, and if he thinks that Putler will be defeated if he pisses and shidds and cries enough.

We can't let Putler win or the Russians will unleash [CW: SA Mention] ::: spoiler spoiler rape and murder squads ::: in the areas they control and also kidnap children, and also attack Nato next
- Oh wow so just full barbarian hordes stuff, huh?
- How does this friend of yours feel about what's going in Gaza right now?

Also while apparently it can't be denied that the far right has grown somewhat stronger in Ukraine, the Ukrainian military had to rely on militias such as Azov so they wouldn't lose, we should not worry because they haven't seen that much electoral success

You can push back against this strongly if you want, the neo nazi issue isn't just relying on them now because of the war began in 2022 nonsense, as if this was a recent change, on the contrary.

If you haven't already you can reinforce your position by using the well known western media reporting from the period.

These are some of the first page google results for me, perhaps it would be effective to do this in person with your friend, have them google something like this search term(remove the quotes) "Ukraine neo nazi before:2018-01-01" maybe mess around with the date filter in front of him, experiment with after:2022-01-01 for example and see the narrative change.

But here

2014 Guardian Azov fighters are Ukraine's greatest weapon and may be its greatest threat

But there is an increasing worry that while the Azov and other volunteer battalions might be Ukraine's most potent and reliable force on the battlefield against the separatists, they also pose the most serious threat to the Ukrainian government, and perhaps even the state, when the conflict in the east is over. The Azov causes particular concern due to the far right, even neo-Nazi, leanings of many of its members.

Dmitry claimed not to be a Nazi, but waxed lyrical about Adolf Hitler as a military leader, and believes the Holocaust never happened. Not everyone in the Azov battalion thinks like Dmitry, but after speaking with dozens of its fighters and embedding on several missions during the past week in and around the strategic port city of Mariupol, the Guardian found many of them to have disturbing political views, and almost all to be intent on "bringing the fight to Kiev" when the war in the east is over.

The battalion's symbol is reminiscent of the Nazi Wolfsangel, though the battalion claims it is in fact meant to be the letters N and I crossed over each other, standing for "national idea". Many of its members have links with neo-Nazi groups, and even those who laughed off the idea that they are neo-Nazis did not give the most convincing denials.

"Of course not, it's all made up, there are just a lot of people who are interested in Nordic mythology," said one fighter when asked if there were neo-Nazis in the battalion. When asked what his own political views were, however, he said "national socialist". As for the swastika tattoos on at least one man seen at the Azov base, "the swastika has nothing to do with the Nazis, it was an ancient sun symbol," he claimed.

The battalion has drawn far-right volunteers from abroad, such as Mikael Skillt, a 37-year-old Swede, trained as a sniper in the Swedish army, who described himself as an "ethnic nationalist" and fights on the front line with the battalion.

The holocaust never happened and Hitler is a genious, but also the swastica? Don't worry its just an ancient sun symbol lol.

But notice how they try to spin the presence of Russian far right nazis fighting for Ukrainian nazis

Despite the presence of these elements, Russian propaganda that claims Kiev's "fascist junta" wants to cleanse east Ukraine of Russian speakers is overblown. The Azov are a minority among the Ukrainian forces, and even they, however unpleasant their views may be, are not anti-Russian; in fact the lingua franca of the battalion is Russian, and most have Russian as their first language.

Indeed, much of what Azov members say about race and nationalism is strikingly similar to the views of the more radical Russian nationalists fighting with the separatist side. The battalion even has a Russian volunteer, a 30-year-old from St Petersburg who refused to give his name. He said he views many of the Russian rebel commanders positively, especially Igor Strelkov, a former FSB officer who has a passion for military re-enactments and appears to see himself as a tsarist officer. He "wants to resurrect a great Russia, said the volunteer; but Strelkov is "only a pawn in Putin's game," he said, and he hoped that Russia would some time have a "nationalist, violent Maidan" of its own.

Reading comperehension people, its not hard, saying that the Russian "propaganda" is false because the Ukrainian nazis are hand in hand with Russian nazis is not a point in your favor lol.

Many in the Azov battalion with whom the Guardian spoke shared this view, which is a long way from the drive for European ideals and democracy that drove the protests in Kiev at the beginning. The Russian volunteer fighting with the Azov said he believes Ukraine needs "a junta that will restrict civil rights for a while but help bring order and unite the country". This disciplinarian streak was visible in the battalion. Drinking is strictly forbidden. "One time there was a guy who got drunk, but the commander beat him in his face and legs until he could not move; then he was kicked out," recalled one fighter proudly.

Other volunteer battalions have also come under the spotlight. This week, Amnesty International called on the Ukrainian government to investigate rights abuses and possible executions by the Aidar, another battalion.

"The failure to stop abuses and possible war crimes by volunteer battalions risks significantly aggravating tensions in the east of the country and undermining the proclaimed intentions of the new Ukrainian authorities to strengthen and uphold the rule of law more broadly," said Salil Shetty, Amnesty International secretary general, in Kiev.

Human rights abuses in the east(Donbas) region? There is more too about how Azov were already acting as an special police force as well.

There are more articles too here is another one BBC 2014 Ukraine underplays role of far right in conflict

But Ukrainian officials and many in the media err to the other extreme. They claim that Ukrainian politics are completely fascist-free. This, too, is plain wrong.

As a result, the question of the presence of the far-right in Ukraine remains a highly sensitive issue, one which top officials and the media shy away from. No-one wants to provide fuel to the Russian propaganda machine.

But this blanket denial also has its dangers, since it allows the ultra-nationalists to fly under the radar. Many Ukrainians are unaware that they exist, or even what a neo-Nazi or fascist actually is, or what they stand for.

As Mr Korotkykh's case demonstrates, the ultra-nationalists have proven to be effective and dedicated fighters in the brutal war in the east against Russian-backed separatists and Russian forces, whose numbers also include a large contingent from Russia's far right.

Run by the extremist Patriot of Ukraine organisation, which considers Jews and other minorities "sub-human" and calls for a white, Christian crusade against them, it sports three Nazi symbols on its insignia: a modified Wolf's Hook, a black sun (or "Hakensonne") and the title Black Corps, which was used by the Waffen SS.

Even the BBC wasn't bothering with BS narrative about "ancient black sun". The fucking BBC mind you.

And although Ukraine is emphatically not run by fascists, far-right extremists seem to be making inroads by other means, as in the country's police department.

Both articles mention how Azov was already taking control of Ukrainian law enforcement too. This is not just about the army, but a systematic takeover of the entire government.

But wait there is more

I wont quote these others but you can read with if you haven't already and maybe show it to your friend in person.

Politico 2015 Ukraine’s far-right menace

WSP 2017 Ukraine turns a blind eye to ultrarightist militia

Ask him what it feels like to worship Khorne, the God of Blood and War

prolong the war as long as possible

Really saying "

You absolutely have to die" to UA citizens...

Don't forget how Zelensky entirely 180'd from the peace platform he was elected on. And was in the Panama papers. Or how any leftist opposition parties (or any parties that seek to give eastern Ukraine representation) in Ukraine are banned and officially repressed. Or the many other political reforms to concentrate political power. Or how they signed both Minsk agreements and openly ignored them.

The governments of Ukraine and Russia are both bad, but strengthening NATO (even if just in reputation) will have serious repercussions, and the aim of "prolonging the war" will result in nothing but needless civilian deaths and the further strengthening of the extreme-right in Ukraine.

They're backing fascists. Fascists we helped harbor and make. They were bombing anti fascists for a decade. Now we are in a new Red Scare and Lavender Scare. Asov and C19 doesn't need to win elections they just intimidate and directly threaten politicians. Zelensky removed opposition parties (very democratic). So what's left to counter the fascists?

2018 America’s Collusion With Neo-Nazis

2016 Lindsay Graham commits US military aid directly to Ukraine 2014 Nationalism and fascism in Ukraine: A historical overview

CIA INTERVENTION IN UKRAINE HAS BEEN TAKING PLACE FOR DECADES

CIA PROJECT AREODYNAMIC QRPLUMB / QRDYNAMIC

electoral success being historically very important to fascist military cliques

I mean, tbh, I'm a little more sympathetic on this than most Hexbears. Like, no, I don't think Putin is Satan incarnate, and yes, this whole mess is America's fault for trying to pull them into NATO. But broadly speaking all the stuff about Ukraine being Nazi-riddled as a casus beli falls flat when Putin has been happy to use far-right-wing groups like Russki Orbaz for his own benefit, and I don't think Russia is really a credible threat to western hegemony like China is, so I don't see how supporting Russia would be meaningfully revolutionarily defeatist. Sure, people like your friend are psychos who soaked up too much propaganda.

But the war is here now, and I think the only thing keeping your average Ukrainian from living in a war zone is western arms shipments, and tbh that's the only argument that I find really resonates with me.

EDIT: Lot of people big mad about this one lmao

But broadly speaking all the stuff about Ukraine being Nazi-riddled as a casus beli falls flat when Putin has been happy to use far-right-wing groups like Russki Orbaz for his own benefit, and I don't think Russia is really a credible threat to western hegemony like China is, so I don't see how supporting Russia would be meaningfully revolutionarily defeatist.
I don't even support Russia. I'm just annoyed Ukraine having a frightening amount of militant Nazi psychos is now apparently disinformatsiya invented by the Kremlin when Western press was regularly mentioning the problem before the war.
Yeah, the Casus Belli is flimsy af. Just because it is true, or largely true, is not sufficient to mean that this was the real reason for Putin's move.
I think that the breakaway states in the Donbass need(ed) to be defended and that the Crimea was under threat as the next likely target but this was a geopolitical manoeuvre imo.
Idk it's just hard to swallow Russia's military offensive as being anti-fascist when you have Putin repatriating the remains of Denikin and Ivan Ilyin to inter them with state honours.
- If defending Crimea was all that was happening, then yeah, I'd agree with you. But Putin's stated goal is "denazification," which I don't really see any way to interpret except as overthrowing the government and installing one he likes better.
- Maybe you should have based your understanding of the conflict on imperialism, rather than aesthetics. The importance of ideology in fascism must be repudiated.
@ElGosso@hexbear.net This argument is completely devoid of any understanding of how US imperialism created this war, or the self-determination by citizens in Donetsk and Luhansk to leave a state that came to be run by NATO-backed torturers filled with historical fantasies of racism makes Russia look fairly reluctant to participate in it.
the only thing keeping your average Ukrainian from living in a war zone is western arms shipments, and tbh that’s the only argument that I find really resonates with me
Why would this argument resonate with anyone? Are you basing your understanding of Ukraine off post-2022 discourse? You think those concert-bombing wheeled artillery pieces are protecting civilians? You should take a look at SBU headquarters, Patriot batteries can't even do anything against their new weapons. They're certainly not for destroying apartment complexes or community centers.
The USA has fomented far right parties in Ukraine since WWII but what Nuland and friends have done since 2014 is truly despicable. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmaakY-PIAc
- It's actually crazy that you can get away with saying "western arms shipments keep Ukrainians from living in a war zone" on this site. How stupid are these people? Do they not realize a civil war was raging for a decade? By the way, are you German? There's no way you're actually German and saying this.
- I found YouTube links in your comment. Here are links to the same videos on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
  Link 1:
  yewtu.be
  inv.nadeko.net
  yt.artemislena.eu
  piped.video
  Link 2:
  yewtu.be
  inv.nadeko.net
  yt.artemislena.eu
  piped.video
Don't really disagree with much here.
But would it be wrong to say that a fairly significant difference is that while the Russian state is using fascist groups, in Ukraine it's the other way around and fascist groups are using and to some extent even controlling the state?
I dunno, but I just can't forget that classic video from before the invasion, where Zelensky was trying to get his (supposedly) own troops to stop shelling the eastern regions and they literally just laughed in his face and told him to gtfo.
- I mean, maybe at some level but certainly not enough to make one side worth supporting over the other. Like ElGosso mentioned, the best thing is going to be what minimizes suffering for normal civilians, and I don't think that supporting Russia is the best way to that goal
I don’t think Russia is really a credible threat to western hegemony like China is
List of people disagreeing with you on that is pretty long, starting from the governments of every AES and every western state.
the only thing keeping your average Ukrainian from living in a war zone is western arms shipments
What the actual fuck bruh, did you see they are now drafting people with down syndrome?
EDIT: Lot of people big mad about this one lmao
Certified smug
moment
This is a way for the arms industry to continue to expand and malign the world. Ultimately it's all about profits, and our duty is to sever them from their ill gotten gains. That means we shouldnt allow them to export anything. This won't be the final war they make
I think you're broadly correct, though I'd argue the Ukrainian fascist issue is worse, due to structural conditions in their state.
I will say that due to broadly friendly Russia-China relations, a Russian victory would substantially benefit China and allow greater penetration for its overland trade routes. From what I hear they've driven a hard bargin for even the current aid to Russia
But the war is here now, and I think the only thing keeping your average Ukrainian from living in a war zone is western arms shipments, and tbh that's the only argument that I find really resonates with me.
What are you smoking to accept this broken logic? The ukrofascists having infinite resources is the main thing keeping Ukrainians in a warzone. If they are cut off, the Russians overrun them and the war is over.
- I initially misread their opinion thinking they meant this:
  The ukrofascists having infinite resources is the main thing keeping Ukrainians in a warzone.
  I thought it was a perfectly reasonable comment until I realized they meant the complete opposite.

send him this back , and ask him if he considers Propaganda a thing thats only happens to OTHER people ?

I find it helpful to distinguish between the ukrainian state under the zelensky regime, other state-like forces in ukraine like their fascist militia, the ukrainian citizenry broadly, and the people of eastern ukraine/donbass/Crimea. If you just lump all of those groups together as "ukraine" it is harder to have a coherent analysis of the situation because each of those groups have distinct interests and incentives. I've gotten libs to engage with those distinctions before by talking about different levels of government/regions of my own country, highlighting places where the federal government does things that don't align with my interests.

The concept of indivisible security is useful to discuss in the context of nato/US v Russian relations as well. Again, this relates to incentives of the different parties.

All this to say, I have a lot of sympathy for the ukrainian populace at large, especially those in the east most directly affected by the war. I have less sympathy for the formal ukrainian state and their roll of the dice/being led down the garden path by the US, and I have no sympathy for fascists.

With all the details leaked (or rather, reported) by very credible sources about the peace negotiations that was deliberately sabotaged by London and Washington, it has become very difficult to attribute the large part of criminal responsibility to any parties other than these two.

I love how nobody considers any alternatives to supporting one of the sides in the war - either supporting Ukraine because something something democracy, human rights and Putler or support Russia because multipolarity, denazification and NATO expansion.

I only know of one such initiative - the split of the group "Communist Organisation" from Germany which aligned with the Greek Communist Party created a campaign to give financial support for various communist groups in Ukraine and Russia they had contacts with. It was cautious and didn't really go anywhere.

But at least it existed. Why support either side beyond acting like a foreign minister in the 1970s? Where's the proletarian internationalism?

It'd be more productive than the dead end we're in, at the mercy of whatever which state does or doesn't.

Remember - Lenin never supported any side in WW1. In fact, he hoped for an enemy victory, as that would create the conditions for a revolution.
Picking sides in an inter-imperialist war is anti-Lenin.
- From Lenin’s Lecture on “The Proletariat and the War” (1914)
  For a Marxist clarifying the nature of the war is a necessary preliminary for deciding the question of his attitude to it. But for such a clarification it is essential, first and foremost, to establish the objective conditions and concrete circumstances of the war in question. It is necessary to consider the war in the historical environment in which it is taking place, only then can one determine one’s attitude to it. Otherwise, the resulting interpretation will be not materialist but eclectic.
  Depending on the historical circumstances, the relationship of classes, etc., the attitude to war must be different at different times. It is absurd once and for all to renounce participation in war in principle. On the other hand, it is also absurd to divide wars into defensive and aggressive. In 1848, Marx hated Russia, because at that time democracy in Germany could not win out and develop, or unite the country into a single national whole, so long as the reactionary hand of backward Russia hung heavy over her.
  In order to clarify one’s attitude to the present war, one must understand how it differs from previous wars, and what its peculiar features are.
  The war in Ukraine is not WWI.
- Enemy victory for western leftists would be russian victory, non?
Sure. Wherever you live, organize around pushing for your own country (and/or those it has influence with) to back down. War between nation-states is universally war against the working class everywhere.
If you live in Russia, organize around getting Russia to back away and stop expanding the front (though yeah: good luck with that at this point...).
If you live in the U.S. or any Western country, organize around going hands-off and halting the shipment of weapons and halting expansion of NATO.
If you live in Ukraine, organize around pushing for diplomacy, an end to conscription, and all the state repression that's been aimed at anyone speaking up against the war, against NATO membership, against fascists' role in governance and policing and war-making, etc.
Either way, push for a diplomatic end to the meat grinding. Ceasefire, ceasefire, ceasefire. Under any conditions whatsoever, really. Doesn't matter where the fucking national borders finally wind up on a map. Ceasefire. Doesn't matter who last did whatever strike or terrorist act or whatever. Ceasefire. Doesn't matter who said what racist nonsense about whose mother. Ceasefire.
All other problems can and will be solved by us, outside of the "solutions" of (especially neoliberal) nation-states. We will deal with the fascists. We will deal with systemic racism and state-oppression of various ethnicities, etc. We will deal with reaction against the left, labor, and the working class. No war but class war.
In any Western country, of course, this will be interpreted as "pro-Russia". LOL. It's bullshit, of course, but that's the shit leftists have always had to deal with. Especially when fighting on the anti-war, anti-imperialism front.

In addition to links others have shared, here's a link to a CIA document showing they were meddling in Ukraine for decades.

https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/AERODYNAMIC%20%20%20VOL.%201_0113.pdf

Just one? Lucky you. My entire IRL friend group is full of those types. China haters too. I'm not supposed to "talk politics" with some of my friends because it makes them mad (Because they can't refute anything I say and they get embarrassed by how little they actually know about the topic). But if I want to hang out with my semi-cool friends, I have to hang out with my far less cool friends as well.