It's a liberal cesspool full of people who refuse to listen when you speak. I explained how the SMO in Russia was justified going all the way back to fucking WWII and Stepan Bandera to Russia not wanting Ukraine in NATO and some dickhead told me to "tOuCH gRaSS". Didn't even address any of my points, just that "dEnAziFIcaTioN iSnT a gOoD rEasOn, iT's aS bAd aS wMDs".
Fucking moron. I hate that fucking place so fucking much.
Good on you. I left Reddit when they locked Genzedong and i never looked back. It is such a breath of fresh air to be free of that toxic cesspit. It's not just the regular users who are awful, the mods are even worse, and the entire site is heavily controlled by three letter agency employes.
As to their "argument" against the SMO, it is totally moronic. Denazification is the best conceivable reason for starting a military operation. No sane country should tolerate a militarized Nazi regime on their border.
Also there's the little detail that the "WMDs" were a lie while the Nazification of Ukraine was so obvious even the western media were writing about it, and they are still forced to address it because every time they take a photo of Kiev regime soldiers - surprise, suprise! - there is some swastika, iron cross or SS badge that the western media need to twist themselves into knots to handwave away or justify.
And it's not just the Nazi problem and the NATO issue, far too many people omit what is probably THE main reason for why Russia HAD to intervene when they did, namely the eight year long war waged by the Kiev Nazis on the people of the Donbass.
However this, just like arguments about Nazis and NATO expansion, is pointless to bring up when talking to Redditors and will just fall on deaf ears because they do not view Russians and pro-Russian East Ukrainians as human, nor will they ever acknowledge that Russia has a right to have national security concerns and vital interests, let alone a right to act to address these when the West refuses to take them seriously.
Also there's the little detail that the "WMDs" were a lie while the Nazification of Ukraine was so obvious even the western media were writing about it, and they are still forced to address it because every time they take a photo of Kiev regime soldiers - surprise, suprise! - there is some swastika, iron cross or SS badge that the western media need to twist themselves into knots to handwave away or justify.
The gaslighting never ends. I have had people badgering me over this war and yet they couldn't even cite the official Russian reasons for the war, despite being incredibly "savvy" on all "secret" objectives.
Reddit has been only getting worse since 2015 when r/politics became the dominant force. I gave up after the admins literally did a coup on even slightly leftwing subs like r/presidentialracememes.
It's seriously astounding how little needs to be done to propagate lies here. Like, people often fearmonger about government censorship and algorithmic suppression, and those things ARE problems don't get me wrong, but people waaaaaaay overestimate how much it takes to dupe them.
I mean, you can just search "Ukraine" on any search engine and filter out results from 2022 onwards to get articles that blatantly contradict what's being published today. It doesn't take an elaborate scheme to spread disinformation... It doesn't even take consistency...
Your mistake was trying to ask for a reasonable view of Russian government's action. To the average redditoid, nothing Russia does is ever justified in any way. Fighting terrorists? "That's just an excuse to persecute minorities and national liberation!" Fighting Nazis? "Akschually Russia is real Nazis!"
Russian government been doing lot of aping from the west, and these types universally condemn it, without a hint of self reflection. If tomorrow Putin completely withdraws from Ukraine, dissolves the federation and puts pentagon in charge of the Russian military (cough south Korea), they'll still find something to blame.
That Russiagate op really got people believing Russia is the USSR again. Like literally for years it has continuously been demonized just for existing. I'm aware that it's not a worker's state and deserves criticism for its reactionary tendencies, but nuance isn't something that seems to exist when talking about things like geopolitics, which isn't a fucking Marvel movie.
You're not allowed to separate the analytical process from picking a side. If your analysis doesn't confirm that you should unequivocally support the 'good guys', you must've erred in your reasoning.
Unfortunately this logic permeates every Western institution. Analysis is subjugated to liberalism. Coming to conclusions that do not support the status quo is dangerous shit. It puts your livelihood at serious risk.
That, and the lack of any critical self reflection, never raising the question, 'If my analysis keeps leading to conclusions that do not coincide with reality, is reality wrong or my thought process?'
In this current world, as the situation has become, every body is born almost fascist then some education turns them into liberals that are always susceptible to fascism again whenever the state want. When liberals start educating themselves more they start seeing the truth and lies and perils of current system. And when they are exposed to left they accept it as the only alternative.
Those people (if they are not bots) that you are facing on reddit or any other plateform bashing communism are either paid trolls or fascists that must be laughing when called a liberal.
I may be wrong but this take is from my experiences these days. You're more then welcome to correct.
You have it a little backwards. Liberals are kind of the "default" in capitalist society. Fascism could almost be considered an extension of liberalism. It has the same economic values, and often the same political values, just more "mask off" about them. You're right that a liberal who educates themselves ceases to be a liberal, but most people online are not secret fascists, or at least, not consciously so. Liberals just have a lot of overlap with fascists, that's all.
And while we joke about the paid trolls and three letter agents a lot, the truth is that there are plenty of people willing to do their dirty work for them for free. They don't need to be paid, they do it of their own volition, because they see it as "saving democracy from the evil tankies."
I agree that Reddit has more unknowing “Hwell Acktually” types than is good for anyone’s mental health. It doesn’t make discussion any better.
But if you proclaim your hate and call people morons you might be part of the problem. If someone is wrong on the internet you could just be doing them a favour by acting like that.
Ah yes it's certainly my fault that when I tried to answer a question I was met with ignorant hostility because people wanna feel good about their positions as if it's a fucking Harry Potter book.
It wasn't even an "Hwell acktually" moment, they just ignored everything I said.
Nothing more disheartening than when you outline your position and why you believe the things you do only for some lib to just accuse you of things you never said and just ignore everything you wrote. "Smug ignorance" might as well be the motto of reddit.
Once the war is over they will be. The invasion of Ukraine basically created a situation where NATO said enough is enough and has agreed that Ukraine can join. Had Russia not invaded this would most likely not have happened.
If NATO is being forced to let in Ukraine, then why is Ukraine still not a part of NATO after all this time?
If you said this about Sweden I could understand. But everything about Ukraine joining NATO has been speculative saber rattling. As I see it they will never allow Ukraine to join.
The vote will happen once the war is over that has already been publicly stated. The only reason it won’t happen while the war is happening is it would create a situation that put NATO in direct conflict with Russia. Right now it’s just handing the arms to Ukraine.
Had Russia not invaded this most likely wouldn’t have happened.