Letters to the Editor: Your 'protest vote' for Jill Stein is really a vote for Donald Trump

I dont like that voting third party in the US is essentially a non-vote for a party in the "system," but it is. I voted green party in the past, and ended up regretting it. And relavent to Stein, not a good person, or even party, to vote for now. Folks need to be active, and vote down ballot, and in "off cycle" years. Change takes time, the best way to be heard is through the down ballot when helpful.

It's just privilege all the way down. If you're ok with trump, or not worried about him, you're just riding the ivory tower

I wish we'd yell at the non-voters at least as equally as the 3rd party voters.

Who is this article for?

It doesn't address the real problem here: That first past the post voting is a broken system and that main party candidates should make more effort to fix this glaring hole in the voting system.

Because fptp is garbage, third parties are little more than a method to undermine a candidates opposition (in the US in 2024 the green party is ironically propped up in part by the republican party)

By leaving out fptp it just sounds like anti democracy drivel.

Your 'protest vote' for Jill Stein is really a vote for Donald Trump

And it always has been.

I mean doyee?

No one's voting 3rd party because they think they'll win, they're just throwing away a vote for Harris. Their statement is that they have no issue with another 4 years of Trump because their demands aren't being met anyway (cough genocide).

You can argue all day about the rationality and lack of utilitarianism, but it won't change anything.

If MLK were alive, he'd probably vote Democrat because he believes there is a solution in comprise over time, and keeping Republicans out is beneficial to that. (He generally favored the more progressive party).

If Malcolm X were alive, he'd probably be protesting just like the uncommitted group, but choose not to vote if his major demand wasn't met, because his reasoning would be that any promised or hypothetical solutions would not come to fruition. (The Ballot or the Bullet)

Both have valid reasoning, and it can obviously depend on the situation, but it bugs me that 50 years later people still don't understand why people choose to vote a certain way.

Yeah…. She’s a disaster and always has been. Been saying this for years.

If you think casting any ballot is a form of protest you need to learn what real protest looks like.

Hint: It doesn’t involve participating in the system you’re protesting.

I don't get it...why would you even vote for Stein at this point? She's not going to win, she's not going to break the threshold for federal election funding, and I don't see a substantial distinction between her policy and Harris.

Brain worm at least had a 1 in 1000 of breaking the funding threshold. Jill has what, less than a chance of finding the winning lotto ticket in the middle of the desert?

The only result of that vote is boosting Donald's chances.

Why...why would you even vote for her at this point? What's the end game?

Sigh. Sorry deleted by moderator for replying with same thing they said which was I feel necessarily aggressive but it’s understandable.

Anyways;

A vote for Green Party/PSL/etc. is better than the alternative for those voting third party: not voting at all.

Those voting 3rd party will still vote dem down ballot often and will also support dems on amendments and ballot measures.

It is not worth losing the vote across the board, so just chill out and let them vote.

IF the DNC actually wanted those votes it would court those votes. Biggest difference in PSL/Green and DNC is stance in Israel/palestine and some socialist policies. (Well and PSL wants to nationalize the top 100 companies, but that’s probably too much of an ask). Instead of any of that they’ve decided to praise Israel and crack down on immigration. So… sure if you want to court republicans go for it but don’t cry when leftists refuse to vote for you.

Also… people complaining trump supporters don’t vote 3rd party: 80% of third party votes in 2020 were right (libertarian+constitution at 1.22%) 20% were leftist (Green+PSL at 0.31%) so… yeah… 4x more right wing than left wing 3rd party voters.

Edit: updated numbers using 2020 data.

Ah yes, I remember how protest voting went in 2016

I love watching remedial game theory being taught every day on multiple instances. What a delight.

The people who don't vote will far out number those who vote for Jill Stein. Why do we let them off the hook when they would have a larger impact on the election.

Don't get me wrong, Jill Stein sucks, but don't blame her voters. Blame those who don't vote to blame those who blindly vote for trump because of "the taxes"

I am tired of blaming someone who gets 2% for when bad things happen. Blame the 30% who did nothing.

I realize a portion of those who don't vote are due to voter suppression, bring the fire you bring for stein voters to those suppressing votes, it will be a more effective strategy. Stein and her voters are an easy scapegoat.

maybe if they would try to court literaly anything to the left of where reagon was they would not need to worry about people voting there. this is the Dems bed they need to lie in it and not yell at the voters for not longer supporting them

If you guys think the spoiler effect isn't real then I've got a bridge to sell you. I voted Green in 2000. Never again.

If you live in a state that has even a slight chance to go red, yes, you should vote for Kamala. But if you live in a comfortably Blue or Red state, you should vote for the party that best reflects your ideology. I always vote for the farthest left candidate because I think that if my representatives see a strong third-party showing for a left-wing ideology, it will make them think twice before they pivot to the center.

For the editor and anyone else who does not understand math: people voting for Trump means Trump gets a vote.

A vote for Jill Stein means Trump does not get a vote.

Would you rather have someone vote third party or vote Trump?

Maybe we should be asking Democrats why they aren't trying harder to satisfy leftist voters instead?

Bibi marches from genocide to a full-scale war in the Middle East. The donkey glumly follows its master. But they fein suprise when we don't meakly trudge behind.

In California, it doesn't matter because the results are already known. In other states the calculus is a bit different.

Permanently Deleted

Why don't democrats invest in actually bringing people to their movement instead of wasting their time on shitting on 3rd parties? Let people vote who they want to vote for, and who they feel voices their opinions the best. That's what democracy is at the end of the day.

I don't know why people are so worried, surely all the moderate Republicans you courted by mirroring GOP policy on immigration, the border, the military, aid to Israel, fossil fuels, social services, and the death penalty will be enough to win? I was assured by very confident Dems that they didn't need my dumb lefty vote to win this election 🤷

Those internal polling numbers from Michigan must be absolutely atrocious.

anyways, votePSL.org

Because I'm sure that LA, in california, is under threat of swinging right if people protest vote too much. I'm sure of it, it just makes sense.

They say this every single election and then give us genocide joe.

Cornell West 2024.

They never have this energy for the millions of actual Trump voters.

Let's break down this bullshit: A vote for Jill Stein is a vote for Jill Stein. The election clerks count ballots marked for Stein and report the vote totals that Stein received. A vote for Jill Stein is literally a vote for Jill Stein.

The statement that a vote for Stein is a vote for Trump is, of course, metaphorical. It's asserting that a vote for Stein is morally equivalent to a vote for Trump by the speaker's moral reckoning. It's a rhetorical shortcut. This shortcut rests on the notion that either the voter would have voted for Harris, or that it is a moral imperative to stop Trump above all else.

That's a moral judgement call. Other people may judge differently. Flatly stating that a vote for Stein is a vote for Trump so vehemently and absolutely elides any possibility of discourse and clearly tells the Stein voter that the speaker will not listen to or consider any of their views, or reasons to vote for Stein.

Fine, you believe that, but when has telling people more or less directly that you do not have any intention of considering their political beliefs won them over to your side? How is that a good tactic? If it worked, then why not employ it on Trump supporters? Go ahead, tell them that the party you support will ignore what they think and want, and demand they vote for your candidate.

If it doesn't work on them, why should it work on Stein voters?

Voting for Jill Stein is only "taking a vote away" from Harris if you assume that the voter would've voted for Harris without Stein in the race.

That's a big assumption and I don't think there's any good reason to make such an assumption.

Well... That would depend on how many people vote for a third party, doesn't it?

I mean, I know Americans love telling other Americans that voting third party is a wasted vote, but that's a self-fulfilling profacy. If everyone believes nobody is voting third party, then nobody will vote third party, so third parties never win, which will lead Americans to say that nobody votes for third parties.

Your first past the post system and your major news agencies who don't have the decency to pretend to be impartial is really doing a number on your country.

Edit: Always fun to see how Americans get so offended about being reminded of such a simple fact. All the excuses and the downvotes are great indications of how you're all doomed to be stuck with what you have.

You are your own worst enemy.

Media Bias Fact Check | bot support

Looks like I'm not the only one on Lemmy who's not voting for the Duopoly. This is an awesome thread. Thanks for posting, OP!

So practically speaking, there is no anti-genocide vote. There is no health care for everyone vote. There is no reduction in firearm caused deaths of children and teens vote. There is no anti corporate regulatory capture vote. These things just are not possible to achieve in America by voting.

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The genocidal lib fears the well informed Jill voter.

Jill for president. <3

And did that selfless doctor use medical billing codes that would charge the least amount to the patient? Does that doctor take a modest pay compared to the other medical staff who also play a vital role in the saving and preservation of lives. And how much time does that doctor spend with patients compared to the rest of the medical staff?

Edit: I am referring to the doctor who wrote the letter to the editor that this entire article is about. There is a hyperlink at the very beginning.