Microsoft says a Copilot key is coming to keyboards on Windows PCs starting this month
Microsoft says a Copilot key is coming to keyboards on Windows PCs starting this month
Do people actually want this?
Like, I know the megacorps that control our lives do (since it's a cheap way of adding value to their products), but what about actual users? I think many see it as a novelty and a toy rather than a productivity tool. Especially when public awareness of "hallucinations" and the plight faced by artists rises.
Kinda feels like the whole "voice controlled assistants" bubble that happened a while ago. Sure they are relatively commonplace nowadays, but nowhere near as universal as people thought they would be.
Do people actually want this?
Nope. Just like those stupid hard coded buttons on my Roku remote that I have never used.
Maybe I'm a pessimist but this is going to really resonate with the people who are "looking forward to AI" because they read headlines, but haven't actually used any LLMs yet because nobody has told them how.
I want a voice controlled assistant that runs locally and is fully FOSS and I can just run on my bog standard linux PC, hardware minimum requirements nonwithstanding
Mycroft was the best bet for this before now being continued by open voice OS.
All I want is a real life iteration of J.A.R.V.I.S. and several billion dollars so I can blurt out cool ideas and have them rendered and built in a couple hours.
I'll be good I promise.
Not a single soul wants this. They just want to use every foul trick to get you to use copilot (by accident even) just like they do with bing and their other garbage.
Current LLMs are manifestly different from Cortana (🤢) because they are actually somewhat intelligent. Microsoft's copilot can do web search and perform basic tasks on the computer, and because of their exclusive contract with OpenAI they're gonna have access to more advanced versions of GPT which will be able to do more high level control and automation on the desktop. It will 100% be useful for users to have this available, and I expect even Linux desktops will eventually add local LLM support (once consumer compute and the tech matures). It is not just glorified auto complete, it is actually fairly correlated with outputs of real human language cognition.
The main issue for me is that they get all the data you input and mine it for better models without your explicit consent. This isn't an area where open source can catch up without significant capital in favor of it, so we have to hope Meta, Mistral and government funded projects give us what we need to have a competitor.
Sure, all that may be true but it doesn't answer my original concern: Is this something that people want as a core feature of their OS? My comments weren't that "oh, this is only as technically sophisticated as voice assistants", it was more "voice assistants never really took off as much as people thought they would". I may be cynical and grumpy, but to me it feels like these companies are failing to read the market.
I'm reminded of a presentation that I saw where they were showing off fancy AI technology. Basically, if you were in a call 1 to 1 call with someone and had to leave to answer the doorbell or something, the other person could keep speaking and an AI would summarise what they said when they got back.
It felt so out of touch with what people would actually want to do in that situation.
A year ago local LLM was just not there, but the stuff you can run now with 8gb vram is pretty amazing, if not quite as good yet as GPT 4. Honestly even if it stops right where it is, it's still powerful enough to be a foundation for a more accessible and efficient way to interface with computers.
This is the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard of. I'm not buying any keyboard or laptop that has this key. There's enough Linux-first vendors these days that it's easy to avoid (Framework, System76, Tuxedo, etc). It's time to be done with Lenovo and Dell.
This is the dumbest fucking thing I’ve ever heard of. I’m not buying any keyboard or laptop that has this key.
Which is exactly what people said about the Windows key.
Now it's all but impossible to buy a keyboard that doesn't have it. Worse, most of us use it without thinking.
Sure you can call it Super if you like, and even have a Tux key-cap on it, but there used to be a literal gap between the Alt keys and their Ctrl brethren in the lateral directions away from the space bar, and those days are long gone.
There'll be the niche users who stick with old keyboards without this new key, just like there are the die-hards who have stuck resolutely to the old IBM keyboards and the like from pre-1995, but if you want a new keyboard?
Gonna have to shell out a small fortune for a custom build or make do with that dumb new key.
(Shoutout to the Context Menu key which went as unmentioned in the above as it goes unused in day to day use, despite having been included with its Super cousin since day one.)
I don't see an issue with a "super" key. But what would a copilot key bring that's of any value? The super key already does everything you'd need.
Gonna have to shell out a small fortune for a custom build or make do with that dumb new key.
I don't think this is true. Just buy a laptop from a company that ships it with Linux. No Windows, no Windows keys. It doesn't have to be 'custom'.
The article actually says the Copilot key will mostly be replacing Menu or Right Control on existing layouts. So if you're already not using those (or are already re-binding them), it's just a new keycap.
As you said, there used to be a gap there. Replacing a gap makes not that much harm and people find it useful even in Linux for keybindings. In more of an Alt kind of guy, but Super is also there for more combinations available.
The Copilot key appears to be going were the right Control or right Alt key are right now, so that's going to be a bother for a lot of people.
The video made it look like this was the context menu key. This may just be a key cap change for WHQL certification of keyboards.
My keyboard has a Linux key. And I happily use it.
The context menu key is more useful when it's remapped to the compose key.
I fully agree with you, but Framework is definitely not Linux-first. The only OS they offer preloaded on their laptops is Windows. You have to install Linux yourself if you want it.
I think they’re referring to Framework’s support for full Linux compatibility for at least Ubuntu, and making sure that the parts they use have first class Linux support and drivers and kernel integration.
Same, I think I might give the System76 Darter a try when I eventually have to replace my Xps 9370. It's bad enough that my computer comes with a windows logo on the super-key and often windows preinstalled. Shipping with a non-ANSI/ISO layout is a no-buy for me.
Unfortunately, the "linux-first" vendors do not offer better deals than their competition.
It depends on how and what you're measuring. A lot of Linux first, like system 76 and purism, do so e serious work on the firmware and boot systems of their systems. Which for some is a huge value add compared.
They absolutely do, when one considers the negative value of Windows.
Like with the Windows key, this won't be an option.
Ah yes, just like you had that option with the windows key right?
I don't care as long as the placement is ok and I can map it to something useful. I'm a GNOME user so the Windows/Super key gets a lot of use. It's nice to have. A new key that I use for all my custom shortcuts would actually be kind of nice. Who cares that the default key caps are a Windows icon and this Copilot thing? Change the key caps and they are just keys.
This is Clippy v2.0 and I'm sure it will be just as helpful.
They've learned from their mistakes, and concluded that Clippy failed because there was no Clippy key.
at least clippy, for all his faults, had the good sense to be a cute cartoon paperclip.
Oh "great", more crap between Ctrl and Alt.
[Grumpy grandpa] In my times, the space row only had five keys! And we did more than those youngsters do with eight, now nine keys!
In my time it was also nine. Back to the roots. ;->
Why doesn't my keyboard have a thumbs-up key?!
Nice
From the picture, it's just the context menu key with a new key cap.
That's still a new key for some people. My laptop doesn't have a context key, for example.
Aaaaah. I really, really wanted to complain about the excessive amount of keys.
(My comment above is partially a joke - don't take it too seriously. Even if a new key was added it would be a bit more clutter, but not that big of a deal.)
So you can pressed accidentally activating the fucking AI and make the numbers go up so Microsoft can then go and say to investors look millions are using my AI. So annoying.
That's funny, because getting an ad for Copilot inside my startmenu was actually what made me go back to Linux after 10 years.
This tracks.
Why? Win+C launches Copilot already, if you want to use it. It's simple enough currently, why change it? This will just make everything worse.
Why? Investment hype
Bingo
Awesome Keyboard with AI Support
On supported Operating Systems
With separate subscription.
I can't wait to no longer find a keyboard without this key.
Welcome to the custom mechanical keyboard scene.
I'm pretty sure you'll be able to find keyboards with a different icon that the ugly copilot, and then you can map it to whatever you want.
You can always use those keyboards from the 2000's
because most people are unaware of keybindings and when they inevitable tap on the new dedicated key they'll probably be shown a subscription screen for Copilot Premium or whatever they call it.
IMO it's a very disgusting and intrusive way of fishing subscriptions to the AI thing they've invested so much money on.
Really milking that fad before they inevitably push anything useful behind a monthly paywall.
As long as the ability to manually turn off secureboot and remove the OS isn't locked behind a subscription...
Can't wait to see this gone in the next 3 years.
"Oh yeah I remember these keyboards! Good times, that was before the
before the what, op?
BEFORE THE WHAT??
sweats, knowing a time-traveler in our midst refused to tell us about the coming copilocalypse
Alas, often, no. Just another logo we can't be rid of.
In some cases, the Copilot key will replace the Menu key or the right Control key, a Microsoft spokesperson told CNBC in an email. Some larger computers will have enough room for both the Copilot key and the right Control key, the spokesperson said.
That's impressively awful
I guess I can just buy a sticker and remap the AI key to do ctrl instead lol
Hmm, maybe I can use it for the Compose key instead or Right Alt…
Compose has always been Capslock for me
I am getting flashbacks to the multimedia keyboards on yesteryear:
https://deskthority.net/wiki/Multimedia_keyboard
Thanks MS, but no thanks, I don't need it.
I love these, it has actual useful keys
I will admit that the volume wheel was awesome
yeah, the media controls are actually useful.
For real though, I loved those. That wireless Logitech one with the volume dial lasted me a decade.
My mom had one, I absolutely loved using that thing when I did
Please don't.
Wonder if it will be CTRL + SHIFT + ALT + WIN + C
Also known as fist+c
Now I'm wondering, with which fingers would you press all those buttons? The most comfortable way to press these keys with 1 hand is to rotate the keyboard 180 degrees
They don't intend for you to, it's just easier to make a giant button combo that their generic HID driver handles as a special case than to create a custom keyboard protocol with their special key enums and a custom driver that only windows supports.
Woo-hoo! Secondary hyper modifier key - can't wait!!!
Soon we'll be able to emacs the way the developers intended.
Yay! I petition to call it Duper
Can't help but think about how Facebook inc rebranded itself to Meta to chase/promote the metaverse fad.
Lol fuck off Microdong.
Rebranded Cortana?
Destined to fail.
Is it just Cortana? I was under impression they're integrating ChatGPT-like llm into windows.
Chatgpt is just Cortana with better marketing. AI isn't smart, it's just algorithms producing a facsimile of language via pattern heatmaps. What was Cortana if not just an earlier version of the same thing?
""AI"" is all a techbro marketing bubble. Will burst and move on eventually.
Like holy shit we had the autofill feature in Photoshop ages and ages ago and that's just doing what the "intelligent" image generators do. We didn't call it AI back then. All marketing for what amounts to just some interesting algorithms.
Time to buy some more of those little Tux keyboard superkey stickers :)
Is copilot another windows app I'll need to uninstall? Thanks for the heads up!
It should be the reason to switch to Linux, finally, again.
I'm happy as a clam with my 1984 loud as fuck IBM Model M keyboard in Windows.
Think you need a Windows key? CTRL-ESC. I use CTRL-ESC even on modern keyboards.
Best keyboard ever, will also last forever.
I use capslock as superkey.
I actually use caps lock fairly regularly as a embedded systems programmer. With my large hands CTRL-ESC is pretty easy for me.
That's a pretty cool keyboard
I bought mine here but there are other places that restore them.
Can they just make the copilot shortcut on my taskbar permanently fuck off? It appears erratically and I don't seem to be able to get rid of it when it's there.
Right click taskbar.
Taskbar settings
Turn off copilot
They're really pushing this AI shit fr
So it disappears without Windows?
I guess we'll have to find a use for that new key on Linux, and Linux laptop vendors will end up with some alternative symbol for it...
maybe bring back the hyper key! (Wikipedia link)
As long as it’s treated like a media key and not an intrusion of the standard, then I couldn’t care less. It’s a stupid idea, but Microsoft is so often full of those.
Edit> And after reading the article…of course MS is intruding on the standard just like they did with the windows key, but at least that one was turned into “meta” or “super”. I guess this will guarantee I won’t buy another MS keyboard.
On the other hand... Super Duper Key.
Touché
It's Microsoft, intrusion of standards is their entire M.O.
It's the "extend" in "embrace, extend, extinguish".
The Windows key turning into "super" and getting some use on Linux was just Linux DE finding a use for that key nobody asked for.
Couldn't they just convert some existing unused key, like Scroll Lock? To be honest, even Pause/Break seems outdated to me.
Can't wait to accidentally press it while gaming, just like the Windows key!
i dont really understand the revenue model here. i also dont understand how there's going to be enough computational power to do LLM shit for all windows users all the time? this sounds bad for the environment.
Running a pre trained model is much cheaper than training one. But I'd imagine in this case you'll be sending it over to Microsoft Servers, so they can keep track of everything you ever search so they can better advertise to you.
Another key for me to pop off my keyboard. Great.
It's already bad enough that windows 11 has a bing AI button on the top left AND top right corners of the start menu. Like wtf
They did this same thing with Mocrosoft Teams. Microsoft execs are some of the dumbest laziest people.
It is literally just windows-C to open copilot. Good grief. 🤣
And being marketed as "our first upgrade to PC keyboards in 30 years". I want to be in the marketing teams conference room when this got pitched.
Mechanical keyboard enthusiasts have reinvented the keyboard hundreds of times, in the time it took M$ to think up a new novelty key cap.
Let alone an "upgrade" that they suggest could replace the menu or right-ctrl key, thus actually reducing usefulness and possibly even accessibility.
Seriously, so stupid.
what exactly is copilot and how does it vary from cortana
i really only use linux and windows 10 ltsc vms
Nope
Just make it remapable (is that a word?) and I don't really care
Remapping instructions are here
I don't use Windows, but given that their office key just sends ctrl+shift+alt+meta, I'm afraid that this could send something like meta+alt that windows users don't use, but it would be useless for some Linux users that already use that key combo.
I don't think you can easily remap keys in Windows.
Please see my explanation of what I meant by that.
i run linux on a surface and it's great. when it breaks beyond repair though, i won't get another because of bullshit like this
Planning on buying a surface and installing Linux. How's your experience, is there so much bullshit to deal with? I really want a Linux tablet
touchscreen and stuff work fine in linux-surface
you need libcamera for the camera to work
More like micBlow$oft
reminds me of the chromebook search key
Everyone talking it's bad but I think it's not, I mean you got another key for shortcut to anything you want after uninstall that crap it's useless anyway
Yeah. It's stupid and crummy, but it's a new key to bind. But then again, have you ever really used the context menu key? I have not.
Context menu key is kinda essential for navigating without a mouse. I don't use it all that often but I am very glad it is there.
True, I rarely use it when my mouse decided to crap itself
I'm stuck on Windows at work, and I have a terminal open on my work PC 100% of the time for tasks, questions and formatting duties (format list, reorder etc) so maybe this could be OK.
Wording is confusing however, as Github is what I think when i hear "copilot", but I do know both are owned by M$.
I'm not for the extra key, I use a custom ortho split anyway, but I'm guessing it's just the "windows key" again with hype..
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