Trump rages at Biden for wrecking his plans for executions: ‘Makes no sense’

Check out restorative justice models. One in Colorado has boasted 95% victim satisfaction and recidivism crashed from 50 down to like 10%. We can use this data to demonstrate what justice models are better, regardless of a definitive definition.

Some people think the earth is flat - that doesn't mean it is.

Justice is a pretty nebulous abstract thing, I agree with that, but modern society has a pretty clear understanding that retribution isn't Justice.

That's why some people don't get control over what happens to the convicted. We do know our justice system isnt perfect and makes more mastakes than what even the most rational person would find unacceptable. There is no going back once the state murders someone. And unless we have equal punishment for whomever caused a innocent person to be executed by the state. It should be outlawed in all cases.

Well, Kamala had that laugh, so....

"The economy!"

-People who spent $41 billion three weeks later.

Yep I'm anti-death penalty, the 3 that didn't get pardoned should probably just live the rest of their lives in prison. But I'm not going to shed any tears for them.

I understand that and, if you ask me, those 3 guys are pos. My problem is that he said he did it to take a moral stance against death penalty. You can't do that and go "except for these 3 cases".

Nope. The most die hard, anti death penalty believer has no limits and literally says "we do not have the right to take anyone's life, even if they are Hitler. In fact it would be better for society if we got to try to rehabilitate Hitler".
And I agree with them.

I have no such limits. Death, as a penalty, is always unjust because humans do not have free will. Every action, every thought, has some biological, or neurochemical, or material basis for it's happening. Inflicting any form of punishment or suffering on the qualia, the conscious experience of someone, for the illusion of choice we believe to have, is actually just inflicting suffering on innocent beings, because we have no choice.

Now, that's not too say I'm anti-violence. But I firmly believe that every piece of violence should be evaluated as if it was being done against an innocent person. Things like "guilt" or "they deserve it" should not be taken into the calculation when doing violence at all, only the benefits it has to the rest of society. If you are in the position to levy death as a punishment, I would rather just see them locked up for life.

Even the most die-hard anti-death-penalty believer has their limits.

I'd love a source for this. Personally, I don't think we should be in the business of killing defenseless people in any context.

He could be sending a message, and that's what Trump is actually pissed about.

That actually makes sense.

That may be true but singling out 3 people who are currently harmless and saying "you get to die" feels somehow different.

That's the point of taking a "moral stance against federal executions", though — nobody deserves it.

Nothing shouts "Christian" than revenge murder.

Prison should be rehabilatative, not punitive

Class comrades are class comrades.

If you really don't understand why, then I would point you to a quote from Warren Buffet.

"There's class war alright and it's my class, the rich, that are waging the war and winning it."

Now class apologists will claim that WB was trying to foster class solidarity, but that fails to hold water under the scrutiny of his actions. Since, quite literally, the moment that he heard that one of his granddaughters had the temerity to give an interview to one of the Johnson & Johnson kids, he disowned her and hasn't allowed her back in the last ≈ decade and a half, which seems to have had the desired effect since he has another dozen and a half children and grandchildren, and no one in that family has appeared on camera critical of the system since then.

Source: The 1% documentary by said J&J heir

Edit: Happy Holidays everyone. Remember that the good that you do for your local communities will spread farther than you'll ever know.

No, one is the state abusing it's power vs an individual who may or may not be guilty.

The other is an individual risking their life against hostis humani generis -- ie, a brave hero.

The vigilante in order to retain support has a much much much higher burden of proof than the state. The state has many opportunities to kill a man, but the vigilante must only attack those who are both obviously evil and obviously out of reach of the law.

Luigi is popular because he met this burden of proof. If he had killed Jay-Z, or even P Diddy, it would not have been popular. After all, the law caught up with them. Before damage was done, no, our system isn't designed to help people, but it did catch up. In contrast, matt gaetz is obviously evil, obviously outside of the law, and therefore an enemy of all mankind. Im not gonna do it, but I would applaud anyone willing to put their life on the line to take his.

Maybe trump thinks: "Kill count too low, pathetic"

🤔

I mean, he was president during jan 6 and didnt even pardon them

I don't think the government should be able to execute them. However, I am human, they're mass murders, and it's a situation I have no control over, so I'm not going to feel bad about not feeling bad that they're still on death row. I don't get to choose how I feel, just how I act. If it were me making the decision, I'd like to think I'd have commuted their sentences as well, even though I probably would have felt bad about doing so.

Although also, thinking about your comment more, I guess I don't really care about sanctity of life or anything like that. It's more of a power problem for me. Some people deserve to be killed, however nobody should be making that judgement and following through, because it's not something that can be accurately judged. No one should have that power, especially the people in charge. When someone dies who I feel deserves it, it not going to upset me. Would I have killed them? No. Would I have prevented their death if I could? Honestly, questionable, depending on the person and situation. Is that hypocritical? I don't know, maybe. There might not be an effective difference, killing through inaction vs killing through action, but there feels like a difference to me. Life isn't black and white, I'm driven by a malfunctioning blob of meat, and I do the best I can. I take great comfort in the fact I'm never going to have to make that choice. I hope this gives you some insight into how I view things.

Did no such thing, simply stated who the three that didn't get commuted were, nothing about why they didn't get it.

I guess, continued explanations of why the politics are failing in America. Average citizen, "ok he pardoned more than his son, great. Oh he believes in the dignity of human life (strange way to put it but ok). He decided to leave 3 to die? Umm ok."

It's the same shtick with the "build back america greater" infrastructure bill. It all sounds great for the media till you actually scrutinize it. "Oh you're wanting to spend how much on highspeed rail? Great! Oh, it's all going to a shady company that has the countries worse rail record and has been lining everyone's pockets financially but running a deficit since operation? umm ok?"

Apparently I misunderstood the above

There is an adage that says "Hard cases make bad law". In the end is a case of, what is preferred, let a guilt person go unpunished or punish an innocent person? I personally believe that it is never ok to punish an innocent person. And I think it is not even that extreme when we are talking about capital punishment or be "tough on crime", it is more like, do um prefer to under punish some guilt people or over punish others including some innocents?

I don't think one should be executed if their moral framework doesn't align with the laws created by the state.

I understand why we can't do this today, but I would much prefer the exile method to execution.

I think it's the opposite. The public opinion has turned on him and so everything he does is critiqued. It's nudge on by the media but is also the cycle of celebrities du jour

He is also being charged federally. And that is the capital case.

Like Gandalf said,
"Many that live deserve death, and some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement."

Putting aside some of the practical issues for a moment...

• that legal process makes executions more expensive than a life sentenc
• it's a tremendous power for governments to have and rife for corruption or making permanent mistakes.

Why should society be obligated to suppord, and securely house people who should never be allowed back into society?

I know it won't make a difference to them (who're the cafeteria Catholics, now?) but it is an official part of the catechism.

No, you're right, fuck me for saying that thing that I didn't even say. Your made-the-fuck-up interpretation of my comment disproves anything I have to say. This is a really healthy discourse we're having and it's not a glaring red flag that you're so completely full of shit that you can't even have a conversation with the person in front of you, you have to invent a fictional version of them to argue with.

Thank you for educating a non-American

I despise the prevalent use of LLM. That is all off the dome.

I started reading and then stopped to Google to make sure it wasn't real. 🤣🤣

these where what caught my eye:

The blue of the rug seemed to be leaking into the chair. Biden almost has a double leg or it's out of alignment. And his hair seems to merge with the wallpaper.

And strong accusation? Bruh we live in an era where AI slop is basically the norm. Expect people to assume a very staged looking photo where Trump has the appearance of a shocked baby and Biden looks like the good humor ice cream man to raise hackles. And it's a bummer that their job is under threat, but that doesn't mean I'll lower my guard against AI slop.