It's not jealousy

I'm a 30 year old man and I couldn't imagine chasing 18 year olds. I teach college students, I speak to 18 year olds regularly. They're not for me.
- When I was a teen I wonder if I'm older if I would still be attracted to teens. I was training a coworker a few years ago, and she's fresh out of highschool. As soon as we diviated from work conversations I can feel any miniscule amount of attraction I had drain out from my body.
  
  I experience this too, what happened in that conversation that drained you?
- There is a big difference between sex and a relationship.
  If I werent married I'd absolutely screw a woman half my age, but dating one... I see complications.
  
  But that's... not the issue here? Men are much more attractive when they are 20 compared to 40 as well.
  That doesn't make me creep around university trying to get into their pants. It also doesn't inspire me to write sexist stuff online, etc.
  
  Please be at least 36
- But how about 22? 24? 21 maybe?
- Most of the males between 27-32yo I know would definetely do an 18yo girl given the chance, but none of them are actively looking for one because it is weird.
  I guess it is more like a fantasy kind of deal. If I had to guess the reason is that young women are more sexually active than 30yo women. Friends with gfs always complain that it's pretty hard to get them in the mood, like they have to beg. Men are just more sexual than women in general.
  Just had a friend break up with his gf because she would use sex as a manipulation tool.
  
  Young women are not more sexually active. There's a ton of research that younger people are less and less sexual. So maybe stop making things up and posting them online.
  
  This is just false. Women, on average, are most sexually active in their 30s. We have known this for ever... And somehow this garbage thought that young women are more sexual keeps showing up in male focused narratives.

It's definitely more of a combination of disgust and secondhand embarrassment. When I was 18, my mid-30s manager was clearly into me and I definitely thought he was creepy and old and everyone made fun of him behind his back. Now that I'm on the other side, it doesn't look any less pathetic. 18 year olds look like children because I'm old enough to be their parent, and the only thing I've ever felt for one is vaguely maternal affection. The idea of dating them is super gross.

- Theres also a YAWNING FUCKING CHASM between "Yes, If I were single I would really like to have a woman almost half my age find me sexually attractive enough to fuck me" and going out of your way to try and make it happen.
  Also, like none of those 35yo women ever went and flicked the bean after watching the 20yo who mows their lawn go shirtless in summer.
- I'm a guy and when I was 18 I got a lot of interest from women in their 40s. Sexual attraction is just natural.
  
  Yeah, but it didn't start at 18 did it. A number of women hit on me when I was under 18 and no one would think anything of it. We are groomed into it starting with calling 6 year old boys handsome young men and he's a cute kid.
  
  That's on you for attending those kinds of parties.
- There's a lot you can help here, though.
  Don't be a creep.
  Don't lie to your partner about this.
  Don't spin some weird sexist or misogynistic bs theories out of your attraction.
  That's it. Doesn't seem too hard but you'd be surprised how many are struggling with these simple rules of decency and respect.
- Did you mean FOR an instant?
  
  Also yes.
- Nobody should be judging any two adults about a consenting nonabusive relationship.
  After all, women polish the pearl to only age appropriate book porn that has nothing to do with poorly narrated but critically succesful actual rape fantasies built on having no idea what consent means lol.
  You can think a 30 year old and 18 year old shouldn't be dating or fucking all you want. But I'm pretty sure the old pricks and women scoffing at it are doing more virtue signalling than they are lol.
  Don't want people fucking 18 year olds? Raise the age of consent.
  
  The age of consent isn't the issue, it's the objectification of people that haven't even hit physical maturity yet.
  
  It was a real eye opener to me when I started dating to find out just how many women would literally ask to be raped. I probably attract that type more than average because of my physical stature, but still it really creeped me out. Never took anyone up on it.

I'm 46 and married, but if I was single, I absolutely wouldn't want someone almost 30 years younger than me. We'd have so little in common! I suppose if you just look at women as objects to stick your dick into...
- I’m dating someone 8 years younger than me and the only way I think it works is that she likes me enough to learn all the references I make she doesn’t understand.
  
  My wife is only 2ish years younger than me, and she already doesn't get some references purely through upbringing. Only a couple things have been "before her time"
  However, her best friend recently turned 24, married to someone who just hit 21. It feels like talking to children.
  And since between the 2 of us we have 12 nieces and nephews under 15 and I speak to them whenever we're visiting I feel like I can say with a little certainty, it reeeeally feels like talking to children sometimes.

Not to mention, as a 30+ year old, looking at 18 year olds feels…gross. They look like children.
- After 40, the “child age” jumped to like 25 for me. As in those under 25 look like children.
  
  25 is when your brain finishes maturing, so it's when adulthood actually starts. The crazy thing is that we let people join the military, rack up credit card debt, etc. well before that age.
- The flip side of that is so wild. Remember being like 12 and an 18 year old seemed so grown up? Now I see an 18 year old and...yeah that's a child, bro
- Yeah I've got some divorced dad friends who like the college age women and they are just boring AF to talk to. I don't get it.
  Pretty? sure, but boring AF. Give me a little baggage and some life stories and I'm in.
  
  These guys don't want somebody to talk to. They want to relive feeling that age again, but they also want somebody who doesn't have much life experience. Odds are, women their own age won't put up with their bullshit, and they want somebody who won't push back on them
  
  Okay, this is gonna come off creepy… but there are interesting college students. They are just few and far between.

There’s enough illegal shit for me to be disgusted with, I don’t have time to be bothered by any relationship between two consenting adults regardless of how little sense that relationship might make to me.

Normal dudes think those guys are creeps too. I'm in my 40s, and have several guy friends my age who date, and it's always with women their age.
- The post doesn't mention dating, just "wanting" them which I took to mean sex.
  
  How would you know who these guys want to have sex with if not by who they date?

I'm an older dude, I can't hardly stand being near a fucking teenager, much less want to have sex with one, they're annoying as hell. What the fuck is wrong with some people.
- I mean you could maybe try being a compassionate adult around them. Attidudes like this are what contribute to poor inter-generational relationships. It's why boomers blame everything on millenials and why millenials just respond with "ok boomer". Teenagers are people, their brains are developing, some are figuring out their shit, some never will bother to. And they will become older folks who are people just the same. So it behoves us to try being a positive influence around them rather than trying to fuck them.
  
  I mean, as a 45 year old man... I can be compassionate, but let's be real teenagers are annoying as shit.
  This isn't some generational thing, we where just as annoying as that age.
  It comes with being immature and unsure of who you are.
  You'll grow out of it too.
  Youth is wasted on the young.

A friend of mine with daughters told me that he couldn't see the appeal in teen girls, because "I have two; they don't even know how to wipe properly."
- That might be a family problem more than a teen girl problem. 😒
  
  No... No. Teen girls are, in general, pretty gross. Anyone cleaning bathrooms knows. The media likes to portray us as these clean little angels but we're pretty disgusting a lot of the time lol

Reminded of:
Note, the last woman (Eden):
reportedly shouldn’t be on the graph. Ol’ Leo’s single apparently.
- Classic. Seen this chart a few years ago, funny how he’s still sticking to it. Tbh for me it goes from “cool/funny” when he’s in his 30s to a bit “weird” now that he’s around 50, but whatever works for him and his partners.

When I was in my late 20s, I went to a local con with an 18-19 year old coworker and her friend about the same age. Nothing funky, just hey if you're going we're going come roll with us.
Love them to death but jeez Louise I could never date one of them. They weren't even particularly immature or anything but theres nothing to relate on or talk about etc etc.
- It's like a different world. They have different slang, music tastes, different types of friend and school drama, physical energy levels, at a different stage of their life, etc. I agree, what do you even talk about?
  
  It's not really that different. I live in a rural area where you can't afford to stick to specific groups or you'll have nobody to talk to. I'm in my late 30s and my friends have ranged from 18 to 85.
  To be fair the really younger ones were usually attached to a larger group but we still considered each other friends and would hang out and talk about... Well, the same stuff we talk about here online with age-indeterminate people?
  Guys we'll drink and talk trash, mechanics, guns, projects, gaming. Girls more music, culture, many of them are into gaming or hunting/outdoors stuff too believe it or not.
  Couple years ago I was sitting by a fire talking about AoE2 with a 19yo girl, I think the game is older than her but she got into it when Definitive came out on Steam!
  I also have a friend in his 80s I go over for sauna and tea with regularly, he has so many wild farm stories and knowledge to share, plus he is an old school original coder and ham radio operator who is the last maintainer for an ancient database system.
  You have something in common with everyone except the truly stupid, don't be shy and just talk to people
  
  I don't think the people dating in this situation do a lot of talking or even have much in common other than what's in Daddies wallet.

Ironic. I'm in to 30-something women and even 40-something women, but the catch is they have to not be mentally ill
- That goes for any relationship. Men and women. It is harder the older as so many more are paired, and the single ones have a higher likelihood of having… reasons.
  
  Or just baggage, which isn't particularly healthy for your mental state. When looking at my circle of friends, at the latest when your ~35 you will have lived through cheating or other types of betrayal. People often are just assholes to each other and hurt people hurt people.
  I see this as an additional reason though, to not date someone who is still very young.
- Moms friends😩
  
  Friends' mums..
- Yeah, if I ever conquer this damn divorce and my general anxiety, I'm just gonna meet people and hopefully find someone with few enough red flags that I can feel comfortable around them
  
  Relevant username
- 🎵 Stacey's mom has got it goin' on 🎶
- OPE

I keep getting older, but they all stay the same age.

I have always found this argument to be hilarious in a deeply sexist way.
Why? Because it takes two to tango.
If young women really did find older men repulsive and creepy, why do so many of them date older men? Why do a fair number of them marry older men, especially in this era of unprecedented economic opportunities for women?
The fact is, such attitudes against a very historically normal pairing is shaming two people who are functional adults for their very adult choices and decisions.
Or do you somehow disagree that an 18-yo woman isn’t a “functional adult”? Because I see that attitude of infantilizing and bubble-wrapping women against the consequences of their own choices and decisions as deeply sexist, and a prime example of misogyny.
Meanwhile, men of that exact same age can be forcibly conscripted to fight and die in some foreign oil-war that they never had an opportunity to vote against. How are we adult enough at that age to die without any choice in the matter, but women aren’t adult enough to choose whom to be with?
Gotta love that gender bigotry.
- People are probably not functional adults until 23-25. But it's harder to mold a 25yo to die in a war for you than a 18yo.
  I do agree with your general point - it takes two to tango. And a lot of the older women complaining have themselves dated across the chasm when they were younger.
  It always felt odd to me and still does though - I feel that the larger the gap the more it reveals deeper issues for both sides.
  
  But it's harder to mold a 25yo to die in a war for you than a 18yo.
  Yup. Between education and maturity, I became a (mostly) pacifist by 25, after fully intending to join up before I started uni.
  
  What I also find deeply hypocritical is how many of these women treat a gender chasm in the first place:
  Young woman with older man? That pervert! He’s a pedophile!!
  Older woman with a young guy? You go, girl! Ride him like a cowgirl!
  And yes, that age gap can be identical in both examples.
- It's been scientifically proven that 18 year olds' brains aren't fully developed. Biologically, no you are not an adult at 18. Arguing that it's all good because both parties are ostensibly consenting adults is besides the point. The older party, no matter what gender, shouldn't be chasing people well outside their peer group. There's obviously a layer of manipulation when 2 people of wildly different ages get together.
- 18 year olds aren't really adults.
- why do so many of them date older men?
  Do they?
  Or do you somehow disagree that an 18-yo woman isn’t a “functional adult”?
  I do, because your brain doesn't finish maturing until you're 25.
  Meanwhile, men of that exact same age can be forcibly conscripted to fight and die in some foreign oil-war that they never had an opportunity to vote against.
  That's wrong, too. The age of conscription should be 25, for the reason I gave above.
- You just argued for men not being drafted at 18 - they are mere kids. Women, on the other hand!
- Just say you're attracted to teenagers and stop wasting everyone's time. The answers to your questions have been discussed countless times.
  Creep.

Jesus Christ, this. And the men rarely even realize/acknowledge how predatory they're being.
- I'd be flattered if an 18yo girl found me attractive, but holy hell I wouldn't have wanted to date somebody with the social-intellectual maturity of most 18 yo's even when I was a lot closer to that age myself.
  The ones that do want that, I'd say they're either stuck in the mentality of that age being their own glory-days or wanting somebody they can easily dominate/control, quite likely both.
- If you think women are being preyed on at that age, then the age of consent needs to be raised or Romeo and Juliet laws refined
  
  One has nothing to do with the other. There's nothing wrong with those of similar age being in a relationship. Romeo and Juliet laws require the couple to be within three years of each other. That has nothing to do with 40 year old men creeping on teenage girls. This thread is insane and really shows the demographics of Lemmy.
  1/3 women are sexually harassed in their lifetime. Women have posted their stories about being sexually harassed more frequently as a young teenager than an adult. I personally have been groped and propositioned for prostitution while I was walking down the street in broad daylight. Not to mention the numerous cat calls. Everything stopped the moment I no longer looked like a child. This is what the post is about. Not consensual relationships.

Attractive, Intelligent, Sane
At 18 you can pick 3 but always focus on one. You're looking for "true love", but your crotch isn't.
At 25 you can pick 2, but you still don't know which one is most important. You're looking for "Mr/Miss/Ms Right", but are starting to feel like you're Mr/Miss/Ms Leftover" because a lot of people pair up before you.
At 30+ you can pick one, but you're mostly looking for someone who matches you "child-free" status. You've realised a relationship is something you make, not something you find. This is the age to be wary of "gold diggers" looking for a bankroll.
When you're 35+ it turns from a structured partner hunt into "fuck it, we ride". At this point, you just want to enjoy life, because there isn't much free time!

ITT: older dudes pretending they’re Leo DiCaprio. You’re nooooottt. If you think I am wrong, please hit a college party this weekend.
People of dating age can do whatever they want! But let’s please not pretend that what applies to above average men applies to all men. Or what applies to above average women applies to all women!
From what I can tell, doesn’t matter your age. Any gender can be attractive at an older age, look at JLo or Sofia what’s her name. Depends on your level of attractiveness, above average attractive people have a timeless quality, goes for both men and women.
- So....don't be ugly. Got it.
  
  I am responding to the sexist and ageist attitude towards women that women’s aging is somehow different from men’s aging.
  Yes, older sperm can produce offspring, but that offspring will be less biologically fit than offspring produced by younger sperm. So a woman in prime years is better off with someone +/- 3yrs her age. That’s just biology.
  So older men only talking about women’s aging comes off as insecure and sexist. My posts are just a reality check.
  Personally, I don’t evaluate the quality of a person by their level of attractiveness or their age. I just find that a lot of insecurities that men carry about themselves come out as sexist attitudes towards women. So yeah, sometimes you have to write a brash post to counter that sort of sentiment.

Yeah, I don't get it. I'm 38m and don't find college-age girls attractive anymore. Even in terms of physical attraction, I'm more attracted to women my age. 18 just looks like a kid to me.
- If I see young people of that age group it sometimes makes me remeber of when I was that age and the fun I did/could have had. Nothing in me wants to engage with any of that at all anymore. Just happy care free memories.
  A few years ago a friend had a 40th birthday and his gf arranged a night out. She took us to a night club in a university city. It was such an odd experience. We left pretty fast.
- I'm 38 and anyone under 30 looks like a child to me by now. 28, sure, they're probably old enough despite the lack of life experience and looking a little young, but 18-year-olds still have baby fat! Gross.
  
  40 here. Girl friends constantly need to assure me young women we see are "old enough" bc I think anyone under 30 looks like they're 13.

Just gonna drop this…
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0005789405800395
(It's also on https://sci-hub.se if anyone needs it entirely)
- Sexual arousal and arousability to pedophilic stimuli in a community sample of normal men
  pedophilic
  18 year olds
  Huh?

So I fully believe that the reason that the reason that perceived peak attractiveness is such a different age for men and women is because of predatory intentions. Meaningful and enthusiastic consent is hard to give when someone has that much more agency than you, and I think this is the whole plot.

I think I have a theory, they're assuming other people are just as incapable of empathy or sympathy as they are, therefore the only reason in their mind that anyone would have an issue with it is jealousy.
Add into that the insecure need to make other people feel bad, and they think by loudly proclaiming it for all to hear, assuming that you will feel bad upon hearing their opinion.
So long story short: they're a piece of shit and their opinions should be ignored by all.

The dudes in this thread really managed to remind me how gross it felt when men double my age tried to view me as a sexual object before sexual maturity. At 18, a 22 year old was an old man to me. A 35 year old was older than my fucking father. I didn’t even mature early or wear actual bras until I was legal, but that never stopped the discomfort. Ew guys, do better. You’re not fucking Leo, Leo is fucking creepy too.
- At 18, a 22 year old was an old man to me
  Jesus fuck girl what? That's like the perfect age gap??
  I'm not downplaying creepy ass old men hitting on teenagers but that's fuckin wild
  
  I’m aware of the small difference now, but when I had just turned 18, I was in high school. I had no concept of anything even remotely adult. I didn’t even know how to make a bowl of ramen. 22 year olds had their own apartment, some worked full time jobs, fed themselves independently, they could drink, it was a whole world that seemed so removed and adult to me.

Half your age plus seven, wasn’t it? Assuming both partners are over the age of consent.

Ok but the reverse is more popular here

Why does a man wanting a woman automatically mean he’s going to disrespect her?

Do you understand what you are doing here? Age is a protected class same as race or gender for example.
- Yeah but I'm not an employer.
  
  And still, you shouldn't judge people by their race, gender or age.
- Finding telomeres in your post history from a comment justifying "barely legal" dating is nostalgic
  Are you THE telomeres guy from a few years ago who got removed from Starbucks for harassing a teen worker? Or just an adherent?
  
  What are you smoking?
  
  Do you by chance have a wall with post-its, photos and thread? Do you stalk many people?
  With 18 people are adults. They can vote and get voted into the government. They can sign business contracts or join the army. They can decide the future of the state but not their own relationship?

This image is trying to invent a problem that isn't there. I'm totally down to date someone my age who isn't mentally ill. That's literally my only requirement.
Unfortunately this seems to disqualify a significant percentage of the dating population.

Have you considered they look better and are less jaded?
- I wish people weren't like this so much. If you meet somebody who has both the wisdom of age and a zest for life, hold onto them, because they're one in a million.
  
  Oh yeah that's 30+ age requirement. Definitely.

- Nice thing about getting older is you don't need drinks to have a good time.
- That's purely a us thing.
  
  I mean, technically... no. Drinking age for beer and wine in Germany is 16, while age of consent (with additional protections) is 14, just like criminal maturity: If you're old enough to stand trial, you're generally old enough to decide for yourself who you want to fuck.
  And while legal guardians being present lowers the drinking age to 14 being a guardian isn't exactly compatible with dating a 14yold, that's a position of authority or trust. Buying it for them is also problematic if it's indeed in exchange for sex, counts as prostitution, minimum age 18.
  Thanks a lot, lemmy, that was probably the creepiest thing I ever thought about.