Elon refusing to pay google for hosting could be behind the instability issues.
It’s possible that the enforcement of a rate limit isn’t because of AI scraping, but rather because they failed to migrate before the June 30th deadline.
It's so fucking funny how Twitter and Reddit are imploding on the exact same day lmao.
Is reddit actually imploding or is it just business as usual?
Depends on where you go.
Subs like r/worldnews and r/tech have bottom of the barrel comments, but still manage to get some posts.
r/IAmA had many of the mods leave, so the remaining ones are stopping all "out of Reddit" activities, like recruiting celebrities, verifying identities, and so on. It's pretty much worthless now.
Small niche subs are still working, but the equivalent communities on Lemmy are getting better quality right now.
Not to sound paranoid, but it’s kind of worrying.
In recent years, these sites have been used to pass information quickly during crisis. This can be anything like natural disaster, or uprising and protests.
These big aggregators being incompetently, mismanaged and taken down from public use at the same time, makes me wonder if it’s an attempt to quash communication that’s not coming from a government or mega-corp.
The revolution will not be televised.. by the people.
Yeahhhh, I've been getting less news information since moving to Lemmy. The communities are here, but they have some growing to do.
And then there's the issue of them growing into the correct servers. For example, my first day here I caught a mod on lemmy.ml banning a user for posting an Axios article about China on World News because "Orientalism". The article was a pretty common western take on the Xi Xinping succession plan. Really nothing uniquely anti-China. That especially raises eyebrows given the many conversations had about Lemmy's communist roots from its devs.
Which isn't to say Lemmy as a whole is tainted - just the dev community, lemmy.ml. So I ethically feel the need to avoid their World News community and only use lemmy.world's World News community, but that places me into an even smaller and more split community, giving me even less information. All I can think is that I need to be the change I want to see and intentionally post to/comment on the lemmy.world World News community.
two peas in a pod
Im enjoying the shit show Elon is providing. It's definitely entertaining watching a "genius" at work.
I used to work for a local company that sold parts to Tesla. They were a huge nightmare and wouldn’t pay us. I think that is their whole deal. Not paying the small companies.
FUCK them
Unfortunately that sort of behaviour is common in many sectors where large companies subcontract with smaller companies.
The tactic basically created the whole factoring concept (buying invoices, or using invoices as security for a "loan"/credit).
Over here in Sweden it was construction companies that initially fuelled the development, and the large companies basically required very long payment terms (60+ days) from their subcontractors and then waited to the very last day to dispute the invoice by complaining on some part of the work, further delaying payment. A small subcontractor could often not front being out that much money (2+ months of salaries, materials and other operating costs, cost of fighting the dispute etc) and ended up going bust. Enter financial institutions buying (or "lending" with the invoice as security) the invoice, letting the subcontractor get paid immediately, but of course not the full amount since the factoring company wants to profit from the deal. The factoring companies being backed by large financial institutions (banks typically) have enough money that they can sit out those long payment terms and other "bullshit" since they know those large construction companies ARE good for the money they are owed EVENTUALLY.
Still carves into the margins for the small actors.
Wow such a toxic mechanism should be banned, if I was the small company i would literally perma-call their offices and spam emails all day until payment is sent
I would argue 50% payment upfront and 50% on delivery could be somewhat of a solution, worst case scenario they don't pay on delivery and you wait for half payment
And that's especially a thing in specialized industries. If you manufacture e.g. car parts then there only is a handful of companies possibly buying your products at all, and that one product you specifically designed for one particular car manufacturer you naturally can only sell to that one company anyway. So you simply cannot afford to decide not to do business with one of your customers just because they play dirty games when it comes to paying the bills.
The Trump playbook.
Don't you know? Paying your bills is woke
"Bills" is now considered a slur on Twitter.
What's up with billionaires and not paying their bills?
I think it’s more that people who tend to be billionaires tend to also be kinda scummy people.
You dont make that kind of money being honest and empathetic. The most honest ppl I know that run businesses are barely paying themselves. There's a reason CEOs have higher than normal representation of psychopaths. It allows them to make the best decisions even if it means running the orphan killing machine 24/7.
Think I got rich by paying people?
This is so much more true than I think most people believe.
My husband and I have a small engine business, and I took a free "community entrepreneur bootcamp" class through the local university this spring in the hope that we might learn something helpful. Instead, I learned fun things like leaning on your customers' fears as a marketing tactic (?? 😔🤦) and that the most prominent local accountant - brought in as an expert speaker by the university! - advises his clients to pay as little as possible as late as possible, and most appallingly, I'm not exaggerating, these are the actual words I heard this man say in front of a room full of people: "if one of your employees gets hurt at your business, it's better for you to stand on their neck until they stop breathing than to call for help, because it's so much easier and cheaper to settle a death claim then an injury." And he actually said that it sounds like he's joking but he's not, this is his understanding of the situation.
I genuinely want to see the best in everyone, and I have never before had the experience of fantasizing about a person's death while they were talking in front of me, and it was abhorrent and awful but also... Wtf? How do we even help someone who sees other people as expendable tools the way this person does?
What can we even do about people who not only don't want to live up to their agreements and commitments, but are just straight up out to fuck everyone else over? How do we help/fix that?
In this case I think he doesn't understand cloud hosting at all, so he doesn't see the cost making sense. If you don't value something, the pricetag seems ridiculous and you won't even consider paying it. He will probably realize the mistake eventually.
with higher interest rates, it means they can't get cheap loans, these companies will go under if the rates keep rising
I'm not going to claim I know what's happening, but I like the self-DDoSing explanation because it's even funnier
Lol yeah I saw that one I find it hilarious too.
It's ok guys, Elon told his engineers to just rewrite the stack, so all problems will go away!
Don't worry, I read lex friedman offered his services, must be even better than before.
It's probably the Tesla engineers he brought in who are doing that so it should go great. If you can build the best, self driving car in the world, building a little social network is easy peasy.
Shouldn't we help him by posting 12hr videos as frequently as possible?
How else will Elon and team know that their migration was a success? IIRC, load testing is valid QA.
submarinejoke.jpg
I think it's probably a combination of self-DDOSing and not paying providers. Which any intelligent experienced dev could've told him, but they all got fired months ago.
Its almost like the developers were holding the site together.
AnD TwaTTEr JusT ruNnInG FiNe DaWG
Other companies should follow the lead and fire all this dead weight 🙄
Imagine all the profit!
What is this guy’s problem?
💀
When all this crap started, my guess was that he is some sort of captured asset that's using his position to sabotage the platform to hinder free speech. Initially, he was so strongly targeting any anti-trump/anti-republican assets that it seemed blatantly obvious, but my money is on Russia or China. China being the more obvious option, given they supply a lot of Tesla's materials.
That's all conjecture of course, he could just be an insane despot cutting his nose off to spite his face like Steve Huffman.
That's all conjecture of course, he could just be an insane despot cutting his nose off to spite his face like Steve Huffman.
I luled. Fuck that dweeb.
I had a similar thought... It stands to reason.
Seems to be utilizing the Trump business model, where the check is perpetually in the mail.
Someone owes some Russian & Middle Eastern Oligarchs a lot of money for his Twitter buying fiasco. Same as Trump did for his fiascos. The business model is just them doing what they were told to do.
When all this crap started, my guess was that he is some sort of captured asset that's using his position to sabotage the platform to hinder free speech. Initially, he was so strongly targeting any anti-trump/anti-republican assets that it seemed blatantly obvious, but my money is on Russia or China. China being the more obvious option, given they supply a lot of Tesla's materials.
That's all conjecture of course, he could just be an insane despot cutting his nose off to spite his face like Steve Huffman.
Someone owes some Russian & Middle Eastern Oligarchs a lot of money for his Twitter buying fiasco. Same as Trump did for his fiascos. The business model is just them doing what they were told to do.
"Russia controlls our oligarchs"
Is something that I would have preferred if it stayed on reddit
Someone owes some Russian & Middle Eastern Oligarchs a lot of money for his Twitter buying fiasco. Same as Trump did for his fiascos. The business model is just them doing what they were told to do. In this case take down social media.
Dude wtf?
https://lemmy.world/comment/735384
https://lemmy.world/comment/735849
You have an agenda or something?
Our oligarchs are the most powerful in the world, they are perfectly capable of being assholes without "being controllesd by Russia".
Stop being such a redditor
Doesn't sound like a problem to me.
I read that Elon is moving Twitter from Google Cloud over to Oracle Cloud with his buddy Larry Ellison. The rate limiting may be due to this migration.
Fuck em both
Got downvoted in another post for having this sentiment.
Why should online plebs care about corpo clowns having a fee dispute?
The corporate internet is killing itself, and we'll all be better for it.
They paid the google bill. So far it’s the only one I’ve seen them pay and who knows if they’ll continue.
At this point I have no idea if twitter dying is a planned thing or mismanagement. I made my profile my freshman year of high school and never logged back on. The only thing I'll miss is having a general place for quick updates on projects that I'm keeping an eye on. Guess it's time to fully utilized discord.
Yeah Elon is an idiot, but its hard to believe someone could burn Twitter to the ground this fast unintentionally
Someone literally hacked my account and bot posting for cryptocurrency. I requested account recovery from Twitter and it all just went to hell after that. The process was bizarre. Repeated instructions for steps I already finished, the entire process starting from scratch, no replies.
So my account is out there now, doing who knows what. Congrats, it's a bot.
Someone literally hacked my account and bot posting for cryptocurrency. I requested account recovery from Twitter and it all just went to hell after that. The process was bizarre. Repeated instructions for steps I already finished, the entire process starting from scratch, no replies.
So my account is out there now, doing who knows what. Congrats, it's a bot.
Imagine if this guy had the controls to the oxygen on Mars
he would definitely sell access to it per second.
If it looks like O'Hare and it talks like O'Hare...
Image Transcription: News Article Screenshot:
[A screenshot of a section of an article by the news outlet "Engadget". Text reads as follows.]
More platform instability could be in Twitter's near future. In 2018, Twitter signed a $1 billion contract with Google to host some of its services on the company's Google Cloud servers. [Hyperlink begins] Platformer reports [Hyperlink ends] Twitter recently refused to pay the search giant ahead of the contract's [Highlighted in yellow] June 30th renewal date. [Highlighting ends] Twitter is reportedly rushing to move as many services off of Google's infrastructure before the contract expires, but the effort is "running behind schedule," putting some tools, including Smyte, a platform the company [Hyperlink begins] acquired in 2018 [Hyperlink ends] to bolster its moderation capabilities, in danger of going offline.
I'm a human volunteer transcribing posts in a format compatible with screen readers, for blind and visually impaired users!
You're doing important work! Just wanted to drop a small correction, the news outlet is actually called "engadget" Cheers!
Autocorrect I swear to God...
Sorry about that! I was doing some quickly this morning while on hold calling the doctor's office so I guess I didn't proofread it great. Thank you!
Delicious!
I see that a lot of people complain about reddit, twitter, and whatever mainstream website completely fuck the consumer, but fail to realize one crucial thing. The only time change happens in mob settings is when the pain of no change is greater than the pain of change. I applaud Elon, spez, and who ever else wishes to put there services behind their paywall whether it's an API or just simply viewing tweets. Anyone in the know knows that it's a crock of shit and anyone who isn't is annoyed to the point where change is preferable. The sooner people figure out posting information, entertainment, and other forms of media/knowledge to the benefit of a company is horrendous the better. Now we have the opportunity to get rid of the corporate greed and basically open-source peoples knowledge from around the globe. Although like with reddit, mob mentality poses a real threat to communities like this one, I trust that you all are normal and level headed individuals who can come to disagreements but still respect eachother (as corny as that sounds). I much prefer it over giving more information to companies who use it to profit off of my content, while I receive nothing.
*Edit: Thank you kind stranger for the reddit gold! Glad you spent real hard cash so I can have reddit premium and reddit coins! The lovely people at reddit will be spending your money sitting on a yacht eating grapes in one hand and lobster in the other. I'm sure they are real thankful too! :) *
What can i say ? I just don´t care anymore about twitter. Also any misfortune for space Karen is just a plus at this point
I especially enjoy that, no matter how much he drives the value down, he's always going to owe the full value of the loans.
Yeah and he used tesla actions as a collateral. So if he is not able to make money to pay for the loans, he will lose control of Tesla. I´m savoring every moment that things are blowing up in his face. After this venture fails, he will probably still be rich, but surely not a billionaire anymore and i will vicariously enjoy his fall from billionaire extraordinaire to just a legacy common stock millionaire.
First, watching what's going on with Twitter is like you're in a roundabout and there's a giant car crash right in the middle of the roundabout, and all you need to do is just keep on going around and around and you keep keep on watching it as it keeps getting worse. Lmfao
On the other hand, I can totally understand why he's batting at hornet's nests. He's got to find a way to make that crappy investment somehow profitable. Yeah, you can do whatever you want with unlimited resources, but he's dealing with multiple new realities where Twitter actually needs to figure out how to run as a business instead of as a political charity.
Twitter was profitable before Elon.
Not really. It might have had a profitable quarter or a profitable year now and again, but overall it was a highly unprofitable company almost every year it was public. That was before the current moment where ad rates have collapsed on every platform which is why many other companies which depend on advertising have been suffering at the same time.
Besides Twitter, a lot of ad reliant businesses are in big trouble this year.
find a way to make that crappy investment somehow profitable
With this sudden, reckless implementation of shit, alienating more and more of the very user base that gives the business its' value?
He's created a cascade effect that didn't need to turn into an avalanche, at this point he's just piling one half-baked idea on top of another, and another, and another.
Unless the petty goal is to turn that place into a toxic right-wing playground, which in turn... what does he gain from that, exactly, in case it works out and has a societal/electoral effect? Lower taxes and less oversight, so he can do as he pleases?
Occam's Razor suggests his mind is broken by stress, willful lack of sleep and social media addiction - the attention of millions of both haters and worshippers - incompetently "getting high on his own supply" like Tony Montana, and went into this convinced his shit doesn't stink. And now flailing at the lack of success and here comes A.I. with its' scrapers.
You'll never hear me disagreeing with the concept that Elon Musk is a guy with big problems.
Just look at the variety of broken promises at all his companies. The guy is a snake oil salesman, and twitter is no different.
He happened to win on the stock market roulette wheel, but his barely profitable car company didn't have to be the thing that pulls in all the extra liquidity in the system -- it could have just as easily been something completely different.
Worst part is that Twitter won't even be a toxic right-wing playground, because one of the patented Elon Musk broken promises he made was that twitter would become a free speech haven and it didn't really. People are still getting banned regularly for non-illegal speech.
Algorithm driven social media seems to be scrambling the brains of the elites just as much as they scramble the brains of regular people.
I don't know what will happen with Twitter. Maybe it succeeds, maybe it fails, maybe it just keeps humming along in mediocrity. But what I do know is that wherever it ends up, there was surely a much simpler way to get there.
Well he did try pulling out the cables going into the server clusters. Maybe he got tired and bored before he could pull them all out
🍿
🍿🍿
Let it burn.
Twitter was an important unifying communications tool during the Arab Spring. The Arab spring was a threat to biz as usual in places like Saudi Arabia. The second largest investor in Twitter is Saudi Arabia.
Saudi Arabia killed and dismembered a journalist from the US, more or less in plain sight. Elon is now killing and dismembering Twitter in plain sight to limit its power as a unifying tool that stands as a demonstrable, active threat to capitalism and oligarchs around the world.
Billionaires do favors for other billionaires. It's part of why spez is trying to tank Reddit. Remember how dangerous Reddit was to capitalism's status quo around the time of GME/Robinhood/Antiwork recently.
The specific moment we're in right now is meant to shatter consolidated organizing power on Reddit as we splinter into several smaller alternative platforms (or for some, disconnect entirely). Not saying we shouldn't be in Lemmy, but calling out the larger reality of the moment.
Billionaires do favors for other billionaires.
That's a bit too much conspiracy for my taste, but for sure, billionaires don't do anything for our good.
Exactly. Billionairs look out for themselves first and foremost. They try to maximise their profit.
Musk wants to push more people to pay for verified. The reddit board (not only Spez) wants people to download their app to make it seem like their growing right before their IPO, while simultaneously forcing more ad views. Probably downloading the app also lets them track a lot of extra data about you as well.
No conspiracy needed to explain all this.
The more I've been watching this whole thing play out, the more I'm inclined to believe that something like this is possible.
Unfortunately for these dipshits masquerading as geniuses, the genie is out of the bottle, and there's no way he's getting corked back in. The internet is really all we need, and in the event of the mass coordination required to organize a protest or anything of the sort, the first best option will win. Whether that's Signal, or Lemmy, or Facebook, or whatever. Necessity is the mother of invention and the amount of resources that a pissed off population has will always win out in the long-term. Hell, we'll pull a fucking sneaker net if we really have to.
Reddit has already been compromised for a few years now anyways. I noticed when they started banning people for not subscribing to group think or the more recent examples of permabanning users for anti-Russian rhetoric. There are only a few vestiges of Aaron's original dream of Reddit, found in places like Antiwork or WSB, but they're a drop in a bucket full of site-wide dogshit.
this is old information being recycled to spread misinformed? they renewed their hosting with google several weeks ago.
Probably more related to this: https://sfba.social/@sysop408/110639435788921057
Can't wait to find out he spent/lost $2B so he wouldn't have to pay Google $1B
The new ceo restarted the payment supposedly, so if it is because of Google, that would mean they didn't renew which isn't on Elon for failing to pay.... unless his petulant refusal to pay when he was in charge made them refuse to renew.
Classic Elon playbook. Make wild statement in public to cover for a wild business decision which is the real result. "HAHA oh yea Twitter is down cuz of these limits I put in place, not the fact that one of our core cloud providers shut us off."
There was a post earlier today, but the post limit implementation legitimately did take down Twitter.
In short, twitter ddosed it's self by making 10 calls to its self every couple of time intervals (a minute or less) which would fail, refresh the UI and kick off even more self requests.
"All the woke posts are causing network disruptions because their cancel culture leaks into the routers."
i wonder if we will end using personal webpages with FOSS/affordable domains and integration to forums and video platforms, just to avoid some crazy CEO screwing our content again.
i think social media was good, but we gave the CEOs too much power over our content and accounts.
so... we went from "social media is where society creates media" to "social media is where tech CEO's control and keep society's media hostage".
i wonder if we will end using personal webpages with FOSS/affordable domains and integration to forums and video platforms, just to avoid some crazy CEO screwing our content again.
That's what we had before. And it never stopped to exist, it just dwindled out for convenience.
The "fediverse" is a step in the good direction, but as long as the general user don't care, these huge services will keep being the "main" internet for the forseeable future. Even abusing the userbase and getting batshit crazy with rules and restrictions isn't stopping them.
Meanwhile, some of us are happy on out littler corner of the internet, using RSS to see what's new on individual websites, and depending on services that are either sanely hosted or even self-hosted and interoperable. But that's not for everyone.
thank you for your reply. yes, i agree with your comment.
it's like internet freedom is a forever refugee in constant diaspora, as it is always forced to exile itself from the places conquered by economic and sociopolitic warmongers who only seek profit and population control.
all the time, over and over. one jump every few years.
but we will make it! ^^
This is hilarious. Elon musk has shown he's a moron. He's a serial lier. Elon Musk has once again proven himself to be a foolish and dishonest individual.
and yet there are people who vehemently defend him. they scare me tbh, makes one wonder if they are paid shills or just voluntary ass-kissers.
Well, something like 82% of people in Russia support Putin. A bunch of other countries, like China, which had 75% of people polled stating that the Russia/Ukraine conflict was good for China. Bush 2 had overwhelming support during the early-mid 2000s. Hitler still has fanatics and followers. There will always be a segment of the population willing to straight up murder others, in order to make their own lives more comfortable, no matter how misguided their ideology is.
Get fucked muskrat
“Could be”
😂
I mean it’s all speculation at this point. The guy isn’t honest and wouldn’t admit he brought down the whole site due to his hubris.
I know but July first starts third business quarter. 😂
Edit: third, not second
I think he can't keep proper track of reality at a level where things don't break. This is one of those "sleep machismo" idiots who hasn't had a proper, healthy sleep in years and years. With the stresses he has brought on himself, plus being a willful lightning rod addicted to the attention of millions of people - both the haters and worshippers - his mind is in some sort of late-stage erosion.
What a wasted opportunity of a man. What an embarrassment.
Yeah, seriously. Baseless speculation isn't news, and people here are acting like it's fact because they want their biases to be confirmed.
I'm not a fan of Elon either, but I know tabloid trash when I see it.
Sometimes, I wonder if Elon is really smart? Or he's just super dumb and lucky? The things he said and did are plain weird. I have a feeling Twitter will be going down along with Reddit. Funny thing is, I've never had a Twitter account to start with.
He was born rich, bought businesses where other people had done all the heavy thinking already and marketed himself well. Like Trump is a poor persons idea of a rich man, Elon is a dumb person's idea of a smart person.
Wow, thats...thats right...
I like the line of thinking there:
Jordan Peterson is the insane person idea of a sane person.
Alex Jones is the grifter person ideia of a stand up bussines person.
Please continue to add.
After these last nine months, it's become brutally and very publicly clear that this dude was lucky to be born rich. Doesn't seem like it was that long ago that the world thought he was a visionary, but oh well, the truth had to come out eventually.
Yeah I don’t think he’s really terribly intelligent. I do think that he’s a good ideas person perhaps , but he’s also arrogant and lacks the people around him to tell him NO when he has a bad one.
To open the 2013 WWDC Apple said "there are a thousand no's for every yes".’
We lost Steve Jobs and got to keep Musk , doesn’t seem terribly fair lol.
Lucky enough to have been born rich. He's had a lot of talented people working under him but he, himself, is not that smart and given the past several years, is seeming rather stupid.
Yeah I don’t think he’s really terribly intelligent. I do think that he’s a good ideas person perhaps , but he’s also arrogant and lacks the people around him to tell him NO when he has a bad one.
To open the 2013 WWDC Apple said "there are a thousand no's for every yes".’
We lost Steve Jobs and got to keep Musk , doesn’t seem terribly fair lol.
Lmao just how much worse can it get. What a trip Elon
I thought google charges as-you-go.
For the average user maybe, but for a client as big as Twitter they're probably going to want to take a more hands-on/careful approach, so whatever's in the contract would probably supersede their standard terms.
Cage fight NOW!
Has he bought Reddit yet?
To be fair, Google Cloud is an overpriced and unreliable dumpster fire of a service. I'm surprised Twitter was using them at all. Although, I guess when you're paying billions of dollars, the service you get is different.
Doesn't change the fact that if you agree to pay someone for their service, you must pay someone for their service. I guess being a deadbeat is different when you're purportedly worth billions of dollars.
I thought google charges as-you-go.
At this point I have no idea if twitter dying is a planned thing or mismanagement. I made my profile my freshman year of high school and never logged back on. The only thing I'll miss is having a general place for quick updates on projects that I'm keeping an eye on. Guess it's time to fully utilized discord.
How is this "news" relevant to technology. Seems like complete speculation.
It's speculation, but still relevant to technology. You'll find speculation in most news sources about technologym, otherwise it's just press releases. How large platforms develop is technology news.
In Musk's case, he's divisive so people are more likely to share or comment on posts about him. There's also a large element of schadenfreude.
If you don't think it should be here, downvote away. However, your low effort comment becomes more virtual trash than the post it intends to berate. Instead, you could post better content too.
Ahh there’s that rudeness I was missing from Reddit. Everyone being so nice was starting to feel twilight zone-y
Meh, we have an opportunity to set a new tone and culture. Just power through the noise. I thoroughly enjoyed your post. Cheers!
Blocking them is easy though.
If we block all the tools, they can all howl into a void. Then their online world will be just like their real world.
the people who downvote for no apparent reason with no comment have showed up recently, too
Haven't there been multiple reports of Musk refusing to pay a bunch of shit? Rent, that guy that was disabled and Musk explicitly fired him for it and then had to pay him millions per his contract, oracle for services.
Yes, he's refused to pay rent on Twitter HQ. Also got kicked out of their (empty) office in Boulder for not paying the rent.
Found Elons Lemmy account
