Google is reportedly experimenting with forced DRM on all YouTube videos
cobalt (@cobalt.tools)
If rolled out widely, this would make web browsers and third-party YouTube clients without a DRM license unusable for YouTube playback, download, etc. This would include almost all open-source web browsers and almost all third-party YouTube clients. Archive link to reddit post about this
Probably explains my looping 403 errors on SmartTube, but it eventually loads after several attempts.
It still isn't working for me, apart from live streams
SmartTube?
I just let it roll through the 403 "Applying the fix".error while I did something else. Took maybe 5–10 mins, but started playing and no issue since.
Widevine L3 is trivial to decrypt at this point, there are even APIs on the web to decrypt it. Playready SL2000 is starting to get much easier to decrypt as well.
Forcing TEE based DRM (Widevine L1 and playready SL3000) would have the potential to cause too much collateral damage. They would almost certainly have to have exceptions some devices. If they intentionally break compatibility on browsers other than chrome, they would probably face antitrust issues.
So it is likely there will always either be a way to bypass or decrypt.
I've been thinking about using Nebula. Does anyone has any experience with it?
Its got some great creators, Ive been on there a couple of years. Only downside which some might be glad to be rid of is a lack of comments, and feedback. Without any interaction you're just watching videos; doesn't feel like a community or conversation.
Seems a shame because there are creators who appear to value the voice of the community on a platform where their audience has no voice.
There's a thread from five years ago where a founder Dave Wiskus said they had plans for a thread-like comments section. So it's weird; must not align with whatever else it is they're doing.
I'd say the same thing about dropout TV. How can we get in the comments without a comments section!?
Dropout really needs some way to interact, even if it's just a shared fanmail address. I don't think my view counts make it clear how much I appreciate some of their content and talent.
I tried to contact Grant O'Brien through Twitter (made an account specifically for that), but it didn't look like he was very active at all, probably got more interesting stuff going on. But no artist is too busy to read fanmail, right?
I think they don't want to own moderation of it. Which I get, but ultimately feel the same way you do. I'm happy I'm on there, few years as well, but do wish they had a comment section.
No comments? You might have just sold me on it.
For the comments, I use grayjay with nebula's plug-in so there's the polycentric comments, but there's very little of them.
Wonderful service. Nice, educative sometimes, and entertaining videos. Mixes well with grayjay/my other subscriptions on youtube/odysee.
Been on Nebula (with curiosity stream) for 4 years. They're great. Good price, many of my favorite YT creators are also on Nebula, and their Nebula content either drops first, or has extended cuts and no ads ever.
They definitely have less channels and stuff overall, but a much larger percentage of their content is geared towards my interests. Also, I would say their minimum quality and production values are significantly higher than YT.
More than ever, people need to start using alternatives. I recommend Odysee. It has a couple issues that they're apparently working on but it's easily the best overall alternative.
Youtube Alternatives are only going to start taking off is that alternative is willing to pay content creators enough for them at least a liveable wage. And it needs to be stable Odysee's payment system relies on other people and tips are unstable at the best of times. A youtube alternative has got to have a better payment system than relying on strangers to tip the creator.
Considering how minimal income on YouTube actually is, I don't know if that's actually the main obstacle. There's a reason why even some big content creators have Patreon/Locals.
Its a shame that content creators don't truly own the content on YouTube and can simply opt out of DRM on their videos.
Also weird timing considering boycotting is a common topic right now.
In a way this enshittificication is necessary to make the replacement possible. Whatever it will be.
I pay for Premium and if they actually do this I'll stop my subscription. Web DRM is stupid and I hate that other Streaming Services already have it. Apart from being another resource sink in browsers, it'll stop third party clients which I use and it also turns off Nvidia Shadowplay which is annoying as it doesn't automatically turn back on once the DRM content is no longer loaded.
This kills the YouTube. Maybe not quickly, but it will be a large nail in the coffin should they double down on it.
Google is also experimenting with my not using YouTube any more.
I use youtube for mediocre garbage content to fill airspace. I don't need it. I would be better off without it. Don't push me google, because I'll fucking jump.
I already jumped off of a number of their other services, what's one more?
Funny enough they used to use their own video playback codec which had to be cracked in order for downloaders to work, so technically they've been doing DRM for a long long time.
The number one reason I use YouTube is for fitness routines I can do at home (going to a physical gym means I will not workout), and keeping up on finance news. I will gladly find other ways to get this information. I just use YouTube because it’s the easiest and has all of the people I like in one place.
I'll pay for deezer or apple music if I have to, lol
If they do this my watching 2 hours a day with YouTube Premier is over. I will not subject myself to advertising.
I've almost completely quit youtube. Go ahead drive in that final nail.
Nice! C ya later then! 😂😂
This is fine. I actually encourage this. Let the market decide whether it likes this.
The issue is that hosting costs for videos are insane. There's nowhere else to turn except for Youtube (unfortunately PeerTube is so far off being a reasonable alternative). I would love to see some more competition, but I don't see it happening in the close future. The sad state of things is that 90% of the population won't care if their favorite MrBeast video has DRM.
Maybe entertainment YouTubers should get together and do what Nebula did for educational content. I'd sign up for that, if it had channels I care about onboard. If YouTub decides to hide behind a poop-filled moat, I sure won't be swimming to get there.
The sad state of things is that 90% of the population won't care if their favorite MrBeast video has DRM.
Agreed!!
(unfortunately PeerTube is so far off being a reasonable alternative)
Why? Because of the hosting cost? Where is Youtube getting this for cheap?
That's why I encourage YouTube taking ever more extreme steps to extract their user's worth. If they just take it far enough, there is a chance actual competition might show up.
Hosting costs are high yeah but they are much more reachable if you scope down to "host what you actually need to emit" rather than "try to be a cheap copy of youtube" - the latter is simply pre-setting yourself for failure.
Are a "creator" that focuses on music mostly, or on archiving old TV footage, or recordings of old videogames, or stick animations? You don't need to store everything or even most of everything in 4K 120fps in your peertube, you can just do 480p with 96k VBR (or heck, even 360p with 64k VBR in some cases) and it will be fine! Let the clients who want to upscale upscale on their end. For every minute of 4K video you can host like, almost half an hour of 360p. Similarly a creator who focuses on music dumps only needs the music tracks, not a video track of any kind (just ta video thumbnail will do).
They have been attacking adblocks for the last 10 years, unless they do what twitch does, they aren't stopping it.
The more unusable/unbearable they make YouTube, the sooner users will start looking into alternatives.
I quit twitch exclusively because of the ads
I yt-dlp'd a video off Twitch a couple of days ago with no problem - what am I missing?
Y'all could just pay 🤷♂️
How's that boot taste?
I do pay and I use SmartTube. If it stops working, I'll stop paying.
The only legit complaint in this thread. I agree, that sucks ass. Shit like that makes stuff like f1tv(garbage app) bearable. I'd have quit without F1 multiviewer.
I used to when the price was fair for family plan, but now I'm on the high seas. It's a price issue, they are making billions , no need to fleece us.
I know you’re getting downvoted here but there is a valid question there. It’s the largest streaming site on the internet which takes up massive amounts of storage and bandwidth. How do people propose it’s paid for? You generally either have to have ads (which it seems everyone hates) or you pay for a subscription (which everyone hates). So what is the best model to offset that cost? It’s not a public service.
The problem isn't ads or subscription fees, the problem is ads and subscription fees in addition to the data scraping. Google, and by extension Youtube, harvest your data from all over the internet and use it to sell ads. The data and CAPTCHAs you see all over from Google are trackers (that's how clicking a box can determine you're human) that ars harvesting data and fingerprinting your device to make you easier to identify.
In 2025, do you really want a demonstrably evil company that supports the American kleptocracy to have access to your data?
In comes freetube and invidious: responses to the above problem. By acting proxy to youtube you avoid the ads (which contain spyware) and you avoid downloading site data from Google (which likely contains spyware).
It isn't a payment issue, and the pirates aren't upset about costs, it's just that in the age of glass walls online, we want our fucking privacy back.
You're acting like A) it's not part of a company pulling down billion dollar profits and B) any loss isn't being used to depress tax paid by other arms of said company
We already do, and this is what we get.
Not when I can't even get a DRM-free MP3 from the payments. If I could, I'd reconsider that.
I know I know, that's how the world works. You as the buyer get to set the terms 🤣
How to kill YouTube in one stupid step.
I guess their CEO wasn't paying attention when the music industry got trounced by pirating.
Why would it kill YouTube?
Spotify has DRM for all of their songs, it has not killed music streaming.
What this actually does is make it formally illegal to rip YouTube videos (circumventing DRM is against DMCA). It's also a shot against youtube-dlp, which refuses to cross the line of cracking the DRM, which would be doable, but they don't want to on account of the legal issue.
How exactly will this kill YouTube? This will only kill ad blockers.
Nah, maybe some people will switch ad blockers off, but for most, the msin takeaway will be to look for a competing service.
If they were to force a TEE based DRM like Widevine L1, it would likely cause significant issues as there are a considerable amount of devices that don't support it (for example most PCs).
If they were to use software based DRM like Widevine L3, it would be easy for enthusiasts to crack and the tools for doing so would just get much much better.
Probably not going to kill it, but the number of users and view counts will drop dramatically. The idea is, that it cuts all deadweight users, which reduces Google’s expenses.
Everyone who is allergic to ads, will leave and find their video entertainment elsewhere. As far as those users are concerned, YT will be dead to them.
Those who remain, will either pay up, or have ads shoved down their throats. Line goes up, and shareholders are happy. The money must flow.
As the enshittification of YT has marched towards its terminal stage, many youtubers have already prepared for it by migrating their videos to other platforms. YT doesn’t like tits, so those videos had to go to Onlyfans, Justforfans or whatever. YT doesn’t like guns, so those videos went to Pepperbox. YT doesn’t like providing a steady income to anyone, so many videos went to Nebula. Then there’s also palces like Floatplane, Locals, Playeur etc. I’m sure there are lots of other video platforms too. The way I see it, YT can die, and the fragmented video landscape will only thrive as a result.
It won't kill adblockers, because adblockers don't circumvent DRM.
They went and paid for Spotify.
Like most heavy users of YTP. YouTube will be just fine. Y'all just freeloaders. Pay you cheap bastards.
Already paid in personal data before I was smart enough to try and close the faucet, I don't see why I should pay more
I'd happily pay if youtube stopped falsley demonitizing all the creators I watch. I refuse to give money to copyright trolls. If I pay youtube then youtube just hands a portion of that money to copyright trolls, no questions asked.