Privacy WIN! Apple & Android Unite for Secure Messaging

Privacy win? RCS itself does not support E2EE. Google developed a proprietary extension for RCS to include their "E2EE".
- Looks like that might be changing https://www.gsma.com/newsroom/article/rcs-encryption-a-leap-towards-secure-and-interoperable-messaging/

As long Google keep it proprietary, you have to assume it's not good for privacy. Google lies about privacy all of the time. It's barely been two months since the last time they were found guilty. This is how they operate. It's just a business expense.
- It’s not proprietary, it’s an open standard from the GSMA. Stop spreading this nonsense.
  
  Google's default implementation IS proprietary, so while the spec isn't, the mass-adopted deployment is. Google is in the middle, unless you use a different app (if that's even possible, I don't know as I don't Android).

- bingo yeah. signal and others have always existed.

Remind me again when there is a FOSS application for RCS messaging
- https://media.tenor.com/fKMzakG8oPYAAAAM/jenn-jenn-robbins.gif

I can sort of see why it’s not been a priority for them. Outside of the US nobody uses SMS or the built in text apps. I just went through my phone and I haven’t had a text message that wasn’t business related since July.
- It was honestly surprising to learn that SMS/RCS/iMessage is the most common way to send messages in the US, as it hasn’t been that way in the UK for over a decade now.
  For better or worse, folks in the UK & EU all switched to apps like WhatsApp, Messenger, Viber, etc. due to better features and free international calls.
  It seems like RCS is finally mature enough to compete, but good luck getting folks to move back.
  
  Why are meta products so popular in Europe?
  
  It seems like where I live, RCS is not supported on all carriers (not on mine) - but most importantly, not on all phones. The one carrier that has it says it only works on certain Samsungs (I guess also Google Pixel, but they are not officially sold, even if not unpopular). So even though they're not paid separately like SMS, I don't think anyone would be switching to it from Whatsapp or Telegram.
- Outside of the US nobody uses SMS or the built in text apps.
  Which is for the best, since SMS is insecure.
  
  A better example to show that SMS' are insecure are the Signalling system 7 protocols.
  While it is possible to incerpte SMS, phone calls and 2FA (kinda scary...) it comes with a high cost (14k) and some technical skills.
  However, if you are a vulnerable target, just don't use SMS or any smartphone. Geotracking is also possible !
- I had some! It's the rescue services warning you that the ice is starting to break and you shouldn't walk on it.
- I use QKSMS regularly and I'm not in the US
- Yeah but unfortunately there's a metric f*** ton of them using WhatsApp.

when google and apple are involved, i doubt we can count on it being "a win for privacy", at best a sidegrade because secure messengers already exist.

We had this in XMPP a decade ago & they could have readopted the open standard instead of creating a new one. There is no track record of them not bending the rules to benefit just them anyhow—but this time it was developed exclusively by the tech giants which is absolutely for their benefit with nestled enclaves to meet the bare minimum requirements while still building the garden’s walls higher. Cabal-ass behavior.
- XMPP is very much a valid option nowadays too! Much easier and lighter to host than Matrix, too. I use it with my mom - Conversations is just as easy to use as Whatsapp, and maybe more pleasant.
  
  Cheogram has a better featureset on Android in my experience. Movim has quite a lot of features & good performance for a web app—which covers the folks that “don’t want to install any new apps” (generally the right skepticism, but really most F-Droid ones are safer with less worry), or platforms without good clients. The biggest pushback I have heard was bad iOS clients—but being a self-hostable service with almost exclusively free software clients, it should be of no surprise any iOS dev is lackluster, being an entirely closed platform, anti-GPL, & with a hefty fee just to list an application.

Of course you can't use it without being part of a huge tech duopoly so yay and it doesn't work without googles proprietary messaging app.

They treat this as if e2ee was the privacy grail but it's only marketing to fool people believing they're protected.
The actual contents of the messages aren't as important for privacy. It's the Metadata and a ton of other measures rhay signal implements in their family of protocols.
Talking about e2ee and call it private shows ignorance in what privacy entails.
- Exactly and if you have to use stock android or iOS to get this feature you are agreeing to so much intrusions into privacy that it's sort of moot.
- Good enough to protect against your bank verification codes from being intercepted, as long as the bank also uses RCS's Encryption to send the message.
  
  I assumed that when it comes to SMS 2FA, simswapping is a threat much bigger than interception of the contents...

Despite SMS not being secure I'm determined to stop using WhatsApp and haven't installed it on my new phone. My old phone has WhatsApp business with an auto reply saying to contact me on signal or send a text. Granted I don't have a huge contacts list but 4 people have started using Signal and the rest send a text, so this is good news in my book.

They probably have a separare copy encrypted by keys under their control, but if verification codes text messages also use RCS Encryption, at least its harder for people to hack bank accounts.

That's not a privacy win for anyone. What this is is a marketing win for Crapple and Google.