[Vote] Should we defederate hexbear?

you can get a taste of where they come from (wrt trump at least) in this thread, and if you ask them in good faith about their positions the majority of the users will respond in good faith in kind

Takeaways from the most popular posts:

They LOVE executions

It's pretty difficult for any of them to just say trump is bad without qualifying that ALL US presidents are bad

Trump is "funny and authentic"

"Both sides are bad"

Overwhelmingly they're calling to kill Trump, but isn't that literally just a LARP? This is never going to happen in real life. Once you wade through the execution fetish fantasy and step back into reality, they ever so slightly favor Trump over any other presidential candidate.
- I encourage people to actually read the thread. FaeDrifter has an axe to grind.
  
  Here is one of the responses:
  
  https://hexbear.net/comment/3843515
  
  None of us support Trump, just as none of us support Putin. But there is a sort of overcompensation in reaction to naieve and simplistic liberal narratives that might make it seem like we do.
  
  Leftists get frustrated with the worldview that imagines, to steal a phrase, that Trump is Voldemort and Biden is Harry Potter. Anti-capitalists oppose the Bourgeoisie and Trump and Biden are both in service to them. It isn’t even simply that they are both capitalists - they are both neoliberals, who enthusiastically pursue the goals of neoliberalism - the transfer of wealth and power from the working class to the bourgeoisie, the enforcement of Western imperialism on a global scale, the withering away of society through austerity and privatisation, etc.
  
  Of course it’s fine to support the democrats with the aim of harm minimisation. But liberals are wilfully blind to the fact that the system itself is not ‘rotten’ but rather functioning as intended, and that the scale of change required to have any hope of addressing climate change, wealth inequality, the descent into fascism and so on, cannot come from within liberal ideology at all let alone from the democrat party. Trump is kind of funny too in the way that he infuriates liberals by openly unveiling reality. For example, no-one cared when Obama was putting children in concentration camps, because it was hidden away behind a bunch of shiny rhetoric about hope and change. But when Trump does the same thing and celebrates it, when he brings the racism and inhumanity of the US state into the light and declares fuck those kids, liberals are forced to see the true nature of their beloved country which their ideological fantasies would usually repress. The blatant hypocrisy of their rage is, from the perspective of cynical leftists, both amusing and bewildering.

hahaha just check the replies to your comment.

what would you like to know?

What is hexbear?

Why would the people who want to defederate say that it should be defederated?
- Hexbear is "a leftist social platform centered around community building through discussion, shitposting memes, and sharing content."
  
  It's a self-proclaimed sister-site to lemmygrad.ml, which is an extremist red-fascist community. Hexbear was created after reddit banned the hate subreddit, /r/chapotraphouse.
  
  /c/meanwhileongrad has some examples of both types of content these communities encourage, but you should check them out for yourself.
- Though this is not a description of what hexbear is, you probably will be interested in my post where I stated why I wanted to defederate from hexbear: https://lemm.ee/post/5751850 (shameless self-plug, I know)

We're communists who are very hostile toward racism, transphobia, homophobia, ableism, and other such bigotry. The users of this instance are by and large racist homophobic ableist liberals so they hate us. It's not hard to understand.

Permanently Deleted
- Hahaha no way.
  
  So if I say "We hate bigots and fascists."
  
  You just read "We hate"?
  
  Permanently Deleted
  
  I read "We hate anyone who doesn't agree with us."
  
  Said out loud: "We hate bigots and fascists."
  Unsaid but implied in many interactions: "Anyone who doesn't agree with us is a bigot or a fascist."
  Combine: "We hate bigots and fascists, by which we mean anyone who doesn't agree with us."
  Simplify: "We hate anyone who doesn't agree with us."
  
  Wow I can't believe I said that.
  
  What is it I don't agree with again?
  
  You used "we". Who is "we"? The rest of the discussion implies that "we" means "we Hexbear users".
  
  So here's a better question: how can a White, cisgender, ~~cissexual~~ hererosexual man politically to the right of Bernie Sanders disagree with you without being a bigot or a fascist?
  
  You say that like Bernard is the ne plus ultra of genuine progressivism.
  
  Also did you mean to say heterosexual or did I finally encounter a "LGBTT" type in the wild?
  
  Nah, I meant to say heterosexual and had a brain fart. Basically, someone who came out of the birth canal with a low score in the Oppression Olympics.
  
  Idk should look into that a bit more.
  
  Which views do you hold that are to the right of a center left liberal?
  
  Well, here are a few that are controversial with the extreme left:
  
  Freedom of speech and freedom of religion are good things. While I can't ask the state to let itself be overthrown by ignoring ideological/religious/personality-cult calls to revolt, I don't want a narrowly defined state ideology used as a tool of court politics like Iran or the USSR.
  
  When collective rights conflict with individual rights, I'm mostly in favor of individual rights. If a local group pops up that takes a married woman's property and gives it to her husband, bans divorce, and lets husbands beat their wives, I want my government to use laws mandating equality against them instead of give them communal autonomy. I don't care what color their skin is or what language they speak.
  
  There is no good reason to believe that true communism will ever work for a group bigger than 10,000 people. I'm being generous because I'm not certain it has worked for 3,000. Also, true communism will be very hard to sustain in a commune that reproduces itself by birth to current members if the children have anywhere else to go. Communes that reproduce by attracting new members instead of by birth to current members, a.k.a. monasteries, can sustain communism indefinitely. (Buddhist monasteries have had very large populations, but it's rarely clear at a glance whether the monastery feeds the monks or if they have to work for their own food.)
  
  The more a group trumpets "diversity" and "tolerance", the less tolerance they have for diversity of thought and view. They're overjoyed to recruit any color or shape of body so long as the mind inside toes the party line.
  
  Anarchy (actual lack of a state) is the best friend patriarchy could want. A band of brothers makes a powerful coalition to rob and kill others, or on the flipside to protect their blood relatives. That puts a lot of power into the hands of grandfathers who have a posse of grandsons to fight for the family and can refuse to defend you if you don't obey.
  
  Communist rule has been excellent for education, basic health care, and redistributing the wealth present when the Communists were elected. But it's been poor for increasing wealth.
  
  Where does hexbear oppose freedom of religion? And do you really want freedom of nazi speech?
  
  The individual rights hexbear opposes are landlording and bosses owning the means of production, not this weird shit you brought up in the rest of the bullet. I actually have no idea what you're talking about. Neither anarchists nor MLs want that.
  
  Cuba is pretty functional despite being heavily sanctioned — they developed their own COVID vaccines — but you're talking about actual communes. Despite the name, when people talk about "communism" they don't usually mean actual communes.
  
  "toeing the party line" — you guys literally do the same thing, shunning anyone who thinks like hexbear does.
  
  I'm not an anarchist, but anarchists don't want the wild west. Go read what serious anarchists actually want.
  
  Again, communist nations like Cuba are heavily sanctioned, that is why they are poor.
  
  I think this comment is pretty illuminating, and I don't mean that in a bad way. A lot of you just fundamentally do not know what hexbears think or why, and you don't really share a common political language and set of concepts to talk in, and you end up filling in the gaps with assumptions.
- This really isn't a good look for you, ngl
- smartest liberal
  
  Death to America
- By and large, we are only hostile to those who are hostile to us first. Perhaps the onus is on you to stop spewing hyperreactionary sewage onto the internet that is easily disproven by even 10 minutes of research, rather than expecting us not to respond when you say that shit and then acting like "Oh, golly gee, golly me! I could not have foreseen that people would have been angry at me when I stated this godawful take!"
  
  Starting out conversations by calling us genocide-denying fascists who are only pretending to be LGBTQIA+ for plausible deniability is obviously going to get you fucking swarmed in return, don't act like you didn't do anything and you're just a poor little meow meow trying to have civil discussions
  
  Sorry, but the experience I've had with you guys is that most hexbears are hostile to people who hold different opinions than theirs. I wanted to link to a post where I have detailed the hexbears who are too hostile, but I was worried that that would come off as being condescending. if you want to see it, you should check out my post history.
  
  I’m sorry, is this you?
  
  However, please keep this in mind - that being a Nazi sympathizer does not automatically invalidate one’s opinions on other topics.
  
  I would expect most people to be hostile to that opinion.
  
  hostile to people who hold different opinions than theirs.
  
  Which opinions?
  
  However, please keep this in mind - that being a Nazi sympathizer does not automatically invalidate one’s opinions on other topics.
  
  Quote from one of their posts about Hexbear. Their opinion seems to be that Nazi’s are OK. So I can see why Hexbear would have a problem with that.
  
  What's the opinion you hold on nazis real fast bub?
  
  You know, saying that you're only hostile to people that tell the truth about you is not a very good position to start at.
Who are some of these users? I've been quite active and I'd love to see who these bigotted users are.
We're communists who are very hostile toward racism, transphobia, homophobia, ableism, and other such bigotry.

Lol no you aren't. Trump is especially racist, ableist, and bigoted, and he's the reason RvW was overturned and SCOTUS can strip away minority rights, but according to "you communists" he's a funny big old goofy guy who isn't any worse than anyone else.

Of course it's because Trump is friendly towards Russia. You're fine with any level of bigotry if you think it helps your political agenda.
- you're fine with any level of bigotry
  
  you are lying on purpose, why are you doing this?
  
  You intentionally stripped out the context of my quote to change the meaning and make it look like I said something different than I actually said.
  
  You did that on purpose, why?
  
  If you would like to include the entire quote and full meaning, I will be happy to discuss with you further.
  
  The context is right there, right above my comment. Everyone reading this sentence just read the context seconds ago.
You can't be woke while supporting Lenin, Stalin, or any other leader of Russia, ever.