4w ago

Starvation looms as Israel's total blockade on Gaza enters its third month

www.nbcnews.com

41 comments

What can be done about this? Obviously Trump won’t intervene, so what other levers of action can people push against?
- You can spread the word. Conveniently, the site has a lot of information about things average people can do to oppose Israel's genocide and horrific acts in general beyond just boycotting, divestment and sanctions.
  
  One issue with BDS is they also support the boycott of Israeli-Palestinian grassroots peace initiatives. BDS demands boycott of all Israelis and Israel related people. That means dialogue, building bridges, personal connections, and so on is being opposed. Boycotting everything Israel also harms Palestinians. BDS also means boycotting Israeli artists, that are critical of the government as well.
  Norman Finkelstein also doesn’t support BDS. Even though he‘s very critical of Israel‘s policies.
  So consider this before you blindly support BDS. If you hate Israel and want to see it destroyed, sure go ahead. If you want peaceful coexistence, BDS is not the way.
  
  Even if you don't like their stance on some things, they provide very good information and actionable anti-Apartheid steps the average person can take. If you think one of their stances is counterproductive then just... don't follow it. I'm certainly for cooperating with unequivocally anti-Apartheid Israelis, but for purely tactical reasons it makes sense for BDS to oppose it. As the leading anti-Zionist international organization they kind of do set the tone for anti-Zionist action, and it's a lot easier to make a program more moderate than more radical.
  Boycotting everything Israel also harms Palestinians.
  Lemme reword that for you: "Boycotting South Africa also harms black Africans". Do you see the problem now? Israel must not be allowed to use Palestinians' economic security as a hostage against the international anti-Zionist movement; that'd basically mean giving up.
  So consider this before you blindly support BDS. If you hate Israel and want to see it destroyed, sure go ahead. If you want peaceful coexistence, BDS is not the way.
  As I said above even if you think they're too radical or whatever at this stage of the anti-Zionist struggle anti-Zionist action will take the same form no matter where you ultimately want to end up. That aside, though, why the heck would I not want Israel gone? The prospect of peaceful coexistence with Israel is about as attractive as peaceful coexistence with Nazi Germany; dismantle that shit and build a real democracy in its place.
  
  You will never get engagement when asking people defending Israel about South Africa or Rhodesia.
  They will either ignore the question, or act confused why you'd being up 'countries that don't exist anymore' in bad faith.
  
  Thank you for making my point. Your goal is the destruction of Israel.
  What other countries do you want dismantled?
  
  Hmm... North Korea would be in second place on my list after Israel, and I'd throw a party if the US dissolved into its member states. Additionally Russia seems to be a good candidate since its current structure allows ethnic Russians in Eastern Europe to oppress everyone from Georgians in West Asia to Siberians East Asians. Oh I'd also redraw the borders of Africa along ethnic and religious lines and remove Xinjiang and other oppressed territories from China. I'm more surprised by your claim that there are no states in the world you'd like to dismantle and rebuild/reincorporate into something better; that seems awfully dedicated to a generally pretty shitty status quo.
  
  redraw the borders of Africa along ethnic and religious lines
  You demand in Africa what you abhor in the Levant. That’s exactly what the two state solution wants.
  Ethnostates for everyone, but the Jews!
  
  I noticed you saying Levant instead of Palestine. If you really want peace why do you try to erase Palestinian identity? That aside yes, it's called nuance. Such borders are possible and desirable in Africa because ethnicities there follow nice geographic distributions, while in Palestine Jewish settlement had no geographic basis and therefore it's impossible to draw borders that would satisfy both sides. Also, Zionists have already shown that they can't be trusted to have their own state and not use it for ethnic cleansing.
  
  This betrays your lacking knowledge of Jewish settlement.
  Also I don’t know if it’s more racist towards Africans, Jews, or Palestinians. You seem to have expectations below the floor for all of them. They can be happy to have you as their white savior.
  
  This betrays your lacking knowledge of Jewish settlement.
  You do realize the borders of what supposed to be Israel included more than half the Palestinian population right? This betrays your lacking knowledge of Palestinian and Israeli history.
  You seem to have expectations below the floor for all of them. They can be happy to have you as their white savior.
  Okay if you think malicious European-drawn borders in Africa haven't been massive sources if instability and conflict in sub Saharan Africa then you should learn more history before talking about this stuff.
  
  Of course borders in Africa are a clusterfuck. Remember that the borders in the Middle East are also a bit whack. The border at the Jordan river separates majority Palestinian populations on both sides. The border between Syria and Israel separates the Druze. The Kurds don’t have a state at all.
  You are talking about the 1947 partition plan. That plan meant nobody would have to leave their land and a minority of the other side would live in the Jewish and Arab state respectively. Zionists accepted the plan, the Arabs rejected it.
  I was talking about the population today. Two states with minorities are still possible. Same as you want in Africa.

41 comments