The assassination of United Healthcare's CEO is a real life trolley problem, and a select few are trying to argue to save all lives while the train is going to kill the masses.
The assassination of United Healthcare's CEO is a real life trolley problem, and a select few are trying to argue to save all lives while the train is going to kill the masses.
It appears that in every thread about this event there is someone calling everyone else in the thread sick and twisted for not proclaiming that all lives are sacred and being for the death of one individual.
It really is a real life trolley problem because those individuals are not seeing the deaths caused by the insurance industry and not realizing that sitting back and doing nothing (i.e. not pulling the lever on the train track switch) doesn't save lives...people are going to continue to die if nothing is done.
Taking a moral high ground and stating that all lives matter is still going to costs lives and instead of it being a few CEOs it will be thousands.
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Oh so this will save thousands of lives then? And here I thought they just hire a new CEO while making their services worse to fund the bonuses for the new one. Silly me.
If it was a random death you might have a point. I would still say it makes sense that people would celebrate the death of a villain, but that's beside the point.
This was an assassination, a message on its own even if there weren't literal words carved into the casings. This may well give a person about to make an inhumane decision on behalf of a company's bottom line pause. It's a reminder that those decisions have real consequences, even if not always legal ones.
They'll pause to call up more private security to keep themselves safe while they raise your premiums even more.
A Christmas Carol was just a story, not reality. You're not going to scare CEOs into doing the right thing, especially not with threat of death.
Maybe. You seem to be very certain about how each of these individuals thinks, which is not a level of confidence I often reach with my own opinions.
Well I guess we should just start killing people we don't like just in case it makes the world a better place then, right?
Cause that seems to be the theme of your lack of confidence positions.
Not at all. I said that now this has happened, the humans actually in charge of the decisions which inspired it might adjust their cost/benefit calculations. I didn't say it was right, I said it's understandable why people would celebrate it and I said there's a chance it will have an actual impact.
I'll leave you and your straw man to discuss further; you've got more of an argument with him than you do with me.
They will adjust their cost/benefit analysis - of their personal security.
Ah, so lack of solid opinion is your defense of your support of random killings. You don't actually support it because you don't support anything... but you don't mind if someone else supports in just in case it might help you in the long run.
You're a professional bystander, someone who hopes someone else does all the hard work in making your life easier.
More private security means more people in their vicinity with guns. Hope none of those people has a loved one murdered by these assholes. Statistically that seems unlikely, and finding good security will get harder if demand spikes that much.
Would their security have good insurance? Cause otherwise that’s another potential gunner.
The rich are far more of a coward than your giving them credit to be. They are only so evil because of the lack of consequences, not in spite of.
yes, which is why threats that are backed up with actions are far more persuasive.
Lmao, you honestly think any executive heard any message other than 'i need to spend more on corporate security and body guards'?
Yes, I do. Sure they'll do that, but I think they'll have a tiny bit of second guessing. Would certainly be more impactful if this was a trend rather than one off.
I hear we produce a lot of bullets compared to the number of MBA’s out there
Yeah, and they're mostly bought by bootlickers.
Not immediately, but hopefully the next CEO will learn a lesson from this and have more consideration on how the company affects people’s lives. I feel like CEOs of large corporations have lost the fear of the masses because they think they’re powerful. But they’re not, they just have a lot of money, a bullet can still kill them.
First time seeing a CEO get replaced for whatever reason?don't worry, we've all been there.
Blue cross just backflipped on time limits for anaesthesia, so
And now security services
This hit is probably more about a “pound of flesh” than saving (future) lives. (Source: pulling theories out of the air)
Do you have a solution to help the situation, or do you just like to complain?
If I don't have a solution, I have to agree with murdering people?
That's like if, in order to drive down the price of diapers I just started killing babies, then when you said that was evil and ineffective I just responded with, "oh yeah, well do you have a better idea, or are you just here to crap all over mine?"
All that said, yes, I do have plenty of common sense suggestions for reforms to the healthcare system that don't involve me murdering someone in cold blood, as it turns out.
I wasn't saying that, I was just asking what your solution was. I've seen a lot of people complaining about healthcare and going the doomer route that nothing can be changed, everything will always be awful, just shut up, accept it and die.
So, what's your suggestions?
The issue is you're telling people not to complain in response to someone saying "randomly murdering United Healthcare workers is ineffective and evil." It's an implicit approval of the murder, even while acknowledging that it won't change anything. It's a pretty rough look, even if that's not what you intended.
But, for suggestions that might work, get involved. Campaign for stricter regulations on the insurance industry. Call your congressional representatives. Run for office and work your way up the system, or become friends with someone who is and help them on their campaign. There's any number of ways to make a difference that are better than shooting a man in the middle of the street.
One quibble, this guy wasn't a worker, he was the boss. The decision maker.
Have you done any of the items in your second paragraph? If so can you share how it's gone and what you judge the impact has been?
Sure, but he'll be replaced by another boss. Then another. How many should be assassinated?
I have. I've worked on a campaign for my local congressperson (at the time) whos platform I believed in. I met them through the campaign and got to know them personally. They won and are still serving in Congress today, and have done a good job over the years in my opinion (though I've since moved states and lost contact).
It was shockingly easy to get involved. Literally just approached them when they were starting up their campaign and asked to help. I knocked on doors and helped at campaign events, and I like to think that my contributions (and those of people like me) helped to get them elected.
And, as I say, they were someone that I had the personal cell number of and could contact when I had concerns.
There's any number of ways to make a difference that are better than shooting a man in the middle of the street.
Are they really? How many people have been doing those things for decades with very little to show for it? How much campaigning can a parent paying for cancer treatment for their kid be reasonably expected to do? How many generic responses from representatives not listening to the concerns of their constituents should we trudge through?
Whether or not this shooter was motivated by the reasons we're all assuming is pretty irrelevant at this point. The simple fact that we're having this discussion at this scale demonstrates that people do not believe that the things you mentioned will improve things, and I think that's a perfectly reasonable interpretation of the situation we find ourselves in. Maybe vigilante action is not the answer but I think it's pretty clear that the usual responses you're giving are not resonating with people. Decision makers need to change that perception if they want to prevent people from looking outside the system for answers.
First, I think you're completely underplaying all the huge gains people have made over the years by doing exactly what I'm talking about. Especially at the state and local level.
But yeah, if you think I'm defending the system as perfect and unflawed, of course not. Of course most people don't want to have to dedicate their life to fixing the system. Of course they have other priorities. Kids, illness, etc.
And of course killing a man in cold blood is easier than spending years or decades fighting for the change you want to see.
But I've seen change accomplished by people who believe in the law and civic order. I've seen people make the system work. It is possible.
It's not easy. It requires someone to basically make it their life, and that's certainly not for everybody. But it can be done. And if you're at the point where you're throwing your life away by shooting a man in the middle of a NYC street, there are better ways to use your life than that.
Improving health coverage is theoretically possible, and later on they may get better, but the only things that will improve are a few blue states and even then it’s just small changes.
So dreams of large non violent change are as futile as the murderous rage. Best one can do is make more money or move to a better area or immigrate.