Patrick Breyer and Pirate Party lose EU Parliament seats
Patrick Breyer and Pirate Party lose EU Parliament seats - Stack Diary
Patrick Breyer, a staunch defender of digital rights, laments the Pirate Party’s exit from the EU Parliament as a blow to online privacy.
I always expected us to never address our ecological destruction or climate change in any meaningful way, and instead devolve into some techno-feudalist, fascist dystopia before the civilisation collapses into a death spiral... But man... I've never wanted to be wrong more in my entire life.
Watching the EU regress in unison, back down the auth path, is not how I expected it would go down.
“Cyberpunk was a warning, not an aspiration.” -- Mike Pondsmith
Kinda alarmist tone.
I always expected for the irrational opinion of people in many Western countries that they can get anything by voting for it to meet the hard cold reality, but it never was anything like "end of the world".
I'm hopeful. A certain kind of evil people have felt their power and are slowly becoming complacent, which means that the European societies will get a shot at getting rid of them, for the time being. And then there will be a dawn after this sunset.
Though that "allowing the snake to raise its head" thing should be done carefully, so that you'd still be alive when the opportunity to crush that head arises.
I managed to convince my brother and a friend of mine to vote for them. This is really disappointing. Over half the votes in Germany were for right-wing parties this time, over 16% were for the right-wing-extremist party AFD. Germany really wants history to repeat itself ig.
But at least France is holding its hand this time! 🙃
I voted for him. Sad to see him leave. It doesn't seem like we have many advocates for digital privacy in the parliament.
e: typo
Die Linke voted similarly on many issues to the Pirate Party.
I had somewhat hoped that my fellow countrymen in Germany would not fall for the obtuse populism of the right, but that is exactly what has happened.
I'm afraid there's nothing left to counter this, because voters obviously no longer care about rational arguments and don't even want to acknowledge the real problems of our time. They make it easy for themselves and just blame everything on illegal migration or whatever - just as the right-wingers tell them to do.
In this reality characterized by stupidity and false attributions of blame, it is hardly surprising that important but somewhat abstract topics such as data protection are no longer of interest to the masses. It's enough to make you cry.
As an American, it's really sad to see the EU fall into this trap.
The saddest thing about this is that the Europeans and especially the Germans should really know better. But no, all the lessons from our dark history seem to have been forgotten - or they are simply ignored so that one can once again live in the comfortable world of simple explanations where there is always some minority to blame.
It's not surprising though, the EU has been wanting to become the United States of Europe for a long time...
I had somewhat hoped that my fellow countrymen in Germany would not fall for the obtuse populism of the right, but that is exactly what has happened.
Maybe if you (in the generic sense) stop to say that the people who vote for a certain party is (basically) stupid, we all can start to solve problems. The people who voted AfD, like the people who voted for the Right in every other country, are simply saying that they have (or they think to have) a set of problems. Are they real problems ? Maybe, maybe not. But not even acknowledge what these people are saying cannot end in nothing different.
I’m afraid there’s nothing left to counter this, because voters obviously no longer care about rational arguments and don’t even want to acknowledge the real problems of our time.
Voters don't care for rational arguments because the Left throw them out o the window.
Speaking for Italy, the right wing is in government exactly because the Left wing tried way too hard to lose. If the only thing the Left wing can offer is a multi-gender (whatever it means) leader who dont' even speak about what the people's problems are (or, again, what the people perceive as a problem) why someone should vote for them ? Rationally, why I should vote for a person that don't even talk about what I see as a problem instead of a person that at least talk about it ?
And I think that in Germany it is the same thing, even if for different reasons.
They make it easy for themselves and just blame everything on illegal migration or whatever - just as the right-wingers tell them to do.
Yeah, and the problem is that when the right wing say "the illegal migration is a problem" and people say "the illegal immigration is a problem" the only thing the left wing say is "we need to get more illegal migration". See how the left wing is basically let the right wing win and on easy mode ?
Ok but the AfD is literally just modern Nazis.
Calling people who voted for them stupidity is the extremely charitable label, because malicious and vile would be more accurate in that case.
Comparing Italy and Germany here just isn't equivalent.
What I mean is that the right-wing parties in Germany have focused their entire election campaign on the issue of migration - even the moderate conservatives (CDU). I think this one-sided explanatory approach is wrong and dangerous. On the one hand, I think it is a case of problem shifting. Important issues such as economic and energy policy or climate protection take a back seat to this one, disproportionately presented issue. On the other hand, I think that the isolationist policy advocated by the extreme right (in Germany, the AfD) is an outdated approach, as it does not solve the problem of illegal migration, but merely creates a counterproductive negative mindset towards immigration. And this is precisely what I consider to be very problematic: due to demographic developments, Germany urgently needs workers from abroad - not only, but especially in so-called low-skilled jobs such as nursing. This fact is being completely overlooked in the political debate, which in this country is characterized by xenophobic and even openly racist rhetoric. In short, I believe that the focus of right-wing parties on migration policy is nothing but empty polemics that is based on attributing blame instead of constructive proposals for solutions - we have other problems that need to be solved. I assume that the situation is similar in other European countries.
In the whole bad times lead to strong people, which leads to good times, which leads to weak people, which leads to bad times, we're in the weak people leading to bad times stage. Now things need to get bad enough to start making strong people.
Only problem is the fascists are smarter this time and are pushing everywhere, so this time might not have nation states on the good side.
Only problem is the fascists are smarter this time and are pushing everywhere, so this time might not have nation states on the good side.
Putting that way is stupid. Yeah, maybe what you call fascist this time are smarter but on the other hand what should oppose them is dumber.
Why are you repeating that fascist "strong men create good times" bullshit?
obtuse populism of the right
Don't fall for propaganda either. Left and right are two buzzword used by rulers to manipulate public opinion and always stay in power.
I would gladly vote left, I like social democracy, I don't mind paying taxes for government services, what makes it impossible for me to vote left is that I completely and utterly disagree with the migration policies that have been in place.
They are insane, completely insane.
We need to enforce the EU borders and fundamentally change the asylum process, the current system encourage refugees to take extreme risks by crossing the sea in shit boats, the current system also encourage braindrain from poor countries preventing them from gettng the skilled workers they need to develop their economies.
Restricting the right of asylum will severely cut back on the human trafficing organization's proftis and reduce the ammount of death and injury in a dangerous ocean crossing.
It will also allow us to sped less money supporting people here, and do much more for them in their own home countries.
I am sure I will get downvoted massively, but this is the explanation as to why I won't vote left unless they show that they are serious at cutting migration.
there is good hint of xenophobia in your comment
you probably need to meet some people foreign of your country and learn they are humans just like you
It will also allow us to sped less money supporting people here, and do much more for them in their own home countries.
tax rich people/companies
these are taking your money away for a good cause for everyone
I don't understand how anyone can think that migration policy is the EU's main problem. And I really don't get why someone should vote for a party that does not share their own convictions because of EU migration policy.
Pull effects aren't real. Help eradicating the reasons why the people are fleeing in the first place if you want less refugees.
Not as if the EU would want that, though. There's continents to exploit and money to be made, after all.
Restricting the right of asylum will severely cut back on the human trafficing organization’s proftis and reduce the ammount of death and injury in a dangerous ocean crossing.
Prohibition creates black markets. Restrict asylum and you'll increase human trafficking.
Quick reminder that in a liberal democracy, social movements are more important for progressive change than electoralism.
Join a union. Be it trade union, housing union, or whatever (or even any affinity group). And get active.
Complaining about election results achieves nothing, but sow despair.
Also: voting is important because it lets you choose your enemy. Progressive liberals and social democrats won't fight against you as hard as conservatives and fascists.
Putting this here because some people might read this and think "Voting doesn't matter."
"Progressive" change will only take you further away from liberal democracy and free society.
surpassing liberal democracy is a good thing. I disagree with the free society bit. What definition of "free society" are you referring to?
I'd argue that a progressive country like Denmark with its universal healthcare and universally available college-level education is substantially more free than a freedom-touting country like the United States that limits access to these basics to those with substantial resources.
There are more parties who defend internet privacy then just the pirate party. Won't matter much tho with the current rightwing majority.
They have been very active fighting the chat control proposals that keep coming, haven't really seen others being so active about it besides them. This is really bad.
Is the incoming majority particularly anti-piracy? I thought they were more fixated on leaving the EU, gutting the "woke" public sector, and rounding up all the immigrants for deportation.
Last I checked they didn't have the majority though?
Technically... maybe. Here's a calculator, EPP+ECR+ID+a chunk of the non-attached and non-assigned might make it over the 50% mark, and then there's renew which has neoliberals in it.
But that's not coalition material as the EPP is not eurosceptic, also, that coalition would reach so far right that a good chunk of the EPP would definitely not be on board with it. The populists might also be opposed on reasons of preferring stoking anti-Brussels sentiment over surveillance, and there's plenty of opportunity for rifts, like the RN saying "The AfD is in favour so we're opposed".
Do note than in the EP factions have fuck all when it comes to faction discipline. There's no whip, all there is is plenty of negotiating.
Does the average voter just not care at all about anything actually important? What is even going on here?
We just had a vote for government officials along the EP vote. Less than 60% turned up which means the most common vote was a vote for nothing. The average voter doesn't care.
More and more the average voter earns minimum wage, has to pay increasing rent, increasing food prices, has shit education, degrading public healthcare, etc... last thing on their mind is voting and when they do they follow what the (not independent at all) media feeds down their throats.
These results are just a drop in the bucket in relation to the grim state of German election results and overall societal discourse.
There's not much room for optimism right now. Very dark skies ahead and things may get much worse before they will become better.
Same in Belgium, how is this the new reality seemingly everywhere???
Mass propaganda and some reeeeeaaaaalllly stupid people.
The parties in power are failing to address the problems ordinary people are facing. Problems like the excessive immigration of people from Asian countries, the insane housing prices, rising cost of living etc. People are looking for alternatives.
These extremists know exactly what the problems are and how to talk about them. They also know better to meet people where they are, like on social media. To most people who are ignorant of politics, these parties seem to solve all their problems.
And let's be real, half the population is below average intelligence. Way too many people don't realize or even worse, don't care, about what these parties are really about.
Pretty much the same propaganda "package" is being used all over the world.
Governments work hard and spend billions of public money to try to stay in power, they spend these in modern and technological warfare too.
I have voted PP since their conception, and I think we have them to thank for a lot. Will continue to do so, probably forever. I don't understand how these issues don't get more attention these days. Tech related privacy, anti monopoly, ai safety etc is just a part but they have excellent values in other areas as well.
I was considering voting for the pirate party, but they polled at less than 5% in France and it was not a useful vote, which was evidently needed.
Eh, I'd much rather vote for a party that aligns with my values but might not get a seat, in hopes it will inspire more people to do so next time around.
Vote your conscience while you can. I'm pretty much stuck voting for slightly left of center candidates (in the US) because the opposition is to the right of Kim Jong Un depending on the issue.
I would have voted for the Pirate Party if there was a ballot for them.
Didn't print it beforehand so I couldn't.
Last time I printed my own ballot they just didn't count it and my vote was considered invalid. Even though I had the exact size required by regulations...
Wait, am I missing something here? Are there countries where you don't have all options on the ballot, or at least an empty space?
Edit: Saw your explanation in another comment. Wouldn't having to bring your own ballot also invalidate voting secrecy, since bringing your own indicates that you most likely intent to vote for an unlisted party (and, in reverse, anyone using the regular ballot voting for a party that's listed)?
Same... I hate having to vote useful
I wish I could actually vote for the pirate party. But I can't here. Didn't show up in the election list. They were 2 or elections ago
Sounds like you're the new candidate.
I voted for them. Judging by the numbers, there must have been about three of us.
I was thinking the whole week if I should vote the greens or the pirates but due to the recurring campaigns to establish a surveillance state I did end up voting pirates. Incredibly disheartened they didn't get a seat :(
and unfortunately czech pirate representatives dropped from three to one :(
God fucking damn it
Sad times.
I wanted to vote for them, I did so last time, but they didn't appear on the ballot in my country this time. Couldn't vote for them...
I would have considered voting for them, except there was no list with their name where I live
Well, shit, there goes my vote.
What did the pirate party stand for? I heard of them before, but not much what they stand for other than digital privacy.
I think this election was mainly focused on Migration, economy and green deal. Mainly why the right took over and the green and left lost. People are seeing the negative effect of migration more and more, and diplomats cannot hide it anymore.
Democracy. Real direct democracy, not the representative bullshit. But with the little influence we got, we can't do much better than trying to protect digital privacy right now
Outside of their obvious platform, pirate parties tend to be social democratic, like centre-centre left AFAIK. With more of an emphasis on direct democracy and anti-authoritarianism than bigger mainstream parties.