Just a little friendly compromise, what could go wrong?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tankie
For those who want to learn more about the possible origin of memes like this
- Is there anyone remaining who doesn't know after the million posts about tankies?
  
  I knew the term, but not the origin or its original meaning, so yes.
  
  There is always somebody who doesn't. Doesn't hurt to leave information for people to learn who haven't already

You don’t negotiate with a burglar who breaks in and steals your shit. You shoot them between the eyes.
Anyone who calls for a compromise is either Russian or a complete fucking idiot.
- You shoot people in the face for stealing? Sheesh.
  
  No, you shoot them because you have no way of knowing why they're in your home or what they'll do.
  
  Home invasions aren't stealing, they're a threat of violence and personal harm.
  If you're just looking to steal you do it when no one is home.
  
  Right, the more accurate analogy would be someone breaking into your house, shooting your grandfather, raping your wife, and trying to take your children away as slaves. And also stealing your stuff.
  
  For stealing shit from a supermarket, or a bank, or something of that sort? Nah, fuck the corporations. For invading someone's inner sanctum and defiling their most important space? Justified.
  
  🤷‍♂️ I'm not about to send the message that people can come to my house and take my shit.
  
  They valued stuff more than their lives yes. I'm not taking the chance they decide to come back or get violent.
- The way Russia would negotiate a burglary:
  I get to keep everything I stole, in exchange you won't call the cops, and throw away your alarms and weapons. You will also promise, that you won't be able to defend yourself the next time.
- Can't it be both?

800 years of russian state imperialism isnt enough to convince some people that the rest of Eastern Europe has truly had enough of one of their own imposing their big brother geopolitics on the rest of them. Every shitty empire has their MO, for russia, its always been a game of lies, deceit, and muddying the waters of truth. The guy in the middle is someone whos been drinking water from a poisoned well somewhere.
- Eastern Europe has truly had enough of one of their own imposing their big brother geopolitics on the rest of them.
  Yeah! That's the US's job!
  
  "Hurr durr, It's bad when the US do it but it's fine if Russia does it"

Why does the compromise guy have a hammer and sickle on him? Is it because these countries were formally part of the USSR?
- There are online self-proclaimed leftists who simp for the totalitarian Soviet regime, and often for China as well. The slang term for them is 'tankies'. Generally speaking, they're the ones you see online spreading the "Ukraine has to compromise for Russia's Legitimate Security Concerns!" The hammer-and-sickle is there to represent them.
  It's very bizarre, considering that most leftists I know, even the ones I butt heads with, recognize that Putin's Russia is an imperialist and fascist state. But no one has ever accused tankies of being consistent.
  
  Don't worry, some tankie will be along to correct you that Russia doesn't meet the exact textbook definition of Fascism, so it is actually a utopia.
- He’s a communist from lemmygrad
  
  "communist"
- Today were can clearly see that, communism was always a red herring. Tankies during cold war and tankies today (that love to dress in American flags), were always about supporting of totalitarian regimes.
  The hammer and sickle is to support USSR.
  
  Tankie is a special sort of communist. Doesn't seem fair to paint all communists as tankies.
  
  Nah communism is just naive people trying to enact collectivist policies wholesale not realising or not wanting to believe that such policies are incredibly open to subversion by authoritarian groups.
- OP thinks the west should continue to send weapons to Ukraine until Russia pulls out of all former Ukrainian territory, and putin is deposed and sent to the hague, and Russia is balkanized.
  Most communists want it to end as soon as possible, with the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine currently occupied by Russia remaining either independent or in Russia if they vote that way.
  This is usually misconstrued as supporting Russia.
  
  Ah, so you were in favor of the initial peace plan proposed by Zelenskyy at the start of the invasion?
  with the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine remaining either independent or in Russia if they vote that way.
  ... and what about the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine remaining part of Ukraine? Is that not an option? Does democracy only count if it benefits Russian interests?
  This is usually misconstrued as supporting Russia.
  No, it's simply recognizing the Motte-And-Bailey style arguments put forth by red fash. It's the same pattern as the alt-right.
  
  You sound like a nazi supporter in 1939 supporting the annexation of the sudetenland. What do you mean the nazis should pull out of the formerly czech territories? I haven't heard the russian government give any reason they should be there, that the nazis didn't give.
  
  with the Russian-speaking parts of Ukraine
  Only if all the non-Russian speaking parts of Russia get to vote to leave Russia as well.

"I find that I'm smarter than most people."
"Whatever leads you to that conclusion?"
"I have a hammer and sickle wallpaper on my desktop! Also, those who are not me should learn to compromise. Because I won't lift a goddamned finger to do such a thing myself, yuck. Also, bOtH pArTiEs ArE tHe SaMe."
- You have been promoted to moderator on lemmy.ml. Congratulations!
- “I find that I’m smarter than most people.”
  https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/610:_Sheeple
  Tons of Ayn Rand energy radiating off this post.
  
  Whoosh?
  Like, you're just too dumb to understand the concept of someone speaking as if they're someone else?

We could burn putin? Or just medium rare on a spit toast. The stick is sometimes tied to the guy, but in this case a stick could be driven slowly over the course of a few days. putins usually come with a convenient hole on either side for that. Best of all lots of animals could be fed... maybe 15 or 16 Lions?
It can be just 3 Lions, it's just a compromise.

This image is misleading because only one person wants to destroy Ukrainian state and people: Putin.
To make this image more realistic place putin and his mafia on one side with text "I want to rule forever", Ukrainians and Russians on other with text "We don't want to be killed" and RT in the middle.
- The meme neglects the whole 2014-2022 civil war period in Ukraine. Euromaidan alone kicked off with dozens of dead and thousands injured. Subsequent revolts in Donetsk and Luhansk killed thousands more.
  By the time of the actual Russian invasion, Ukrainian rebels were in full blown street battles with government military units.
  Claiming "Ukraine just wants to be left alone" feels a bit like doing a "Woo-wee, I'm just a small bean Saddam doing a little protest over Kuwaiti slant drilling. Why is mean old George Bush Senior being so mean to me with his Operation Desert Storm?" Or bemoaning the sweet innocent little Slobodan Milošević for doing a policing action in Bosnia.
  
  Ah yes, Euromaidan. When Ukrainians kicked out the Russian puppet politician and replaced him with...
  shuffles notes
  Oh, there was no replacement. They just held a democratic vote and the puppet fled.
  And then Putin retaliated by sending soldiers into Ukraine, which according to Putin, is an act of international aggression.
  
  Who do you think financed and supported those rebels?
  
  There are no Ukrainian rebels.

Ukraine: The Avoidable War
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL4eNy4FCs8
Sources linked in description of video.
- Did you even watch this? Doesn't really support the tankie narrative

Hot take, Tankies aren't as bad as Zionists, and I know which group there's more of, and has more influence and power.
- Both seem to be championing nazi rhetorics and methods.
  
  One is doing that on a segment of a niche internet forum, and the other is doing that on millions of humans. Like I said, I know which ones worse. Zionists get people killed. Tankies yell about things that already happened.
- And neither of them are as bad as 1940s Nazis. And those aren't as bad Maoists. A rotten apple is a rotten apple no matter the variety.
  
  Cops are rotten apples, So are nonprofit universities that use massive endowments to essentially be for profit. No one would claim they're just as detrimental to society as each other. One of the groups is clearly worse and it's surprising how many people are refusing to engage with that idea. If you think Zionists arent getting people killed and Tankies are, I really don't know what to tell you.
- Tankies are as bad. They're just less powerful.
  At least since the fall of the SovUnion
- Who gives a fuck? They should both be shouted down by thinking people.

Zelensky is Saddam Hussein in 1983. The plan for fighting Russia will definitely turn Ukraine into Iraq.
- You mean the plan of not lying down and let Russia take your country? Literally self defense, that "plan"?
  
  The plan of asking the US and EU for help, they have no intention of helping you, they have the intention of hollowing out Ukraine themselves. I never said Ukraine should compromise, I'm saying Ukraine is fucked

To be fair Ukraine have said they intend to fight until the borders are back to pre-war which includes Crimea.
Compromise can be met with Crimea.
Edit: can someone who downvotes explain why you disagree?
- About the only bit that could be compromised on. Crimea isn't going to be retaken by an invasion force, unless the whole Russian military collapses in on itself.
  However, I would note that effectively sieging Crimea is very viable considering the poor state of the Russian Navy in the Black Sea and Crimea's reliance on supply from the rest of Russia. However, that would require most Ukrainian land taken during the initial invasion to be reclaimed first.
  
  A properly supplied Ukraine could probably manage all that singlehandedly given what weve seen.
  
  Yep most definitely, reclaiming the mainland is step one and no compromises should be made there. The decision on the remaining bloodshed and cost required to retake crimea from 2014 annexation can be evaluated at that point.
- Crimea WAS the compromise. In 2014. The orange revolution was the compromise in 2004.
  The disagreement is with the idea that compromise would even result in a real peace. The Russia would stop actively working to dismantle the Ukrainian state. It's not even just Ukraine. Georgia was invaded in 2008.
  At this point, it's just appeasement. And appeasement doesn't work.

It would have been more convincing had Ukraine not spent 2014-2022 pounding cities in the eastern Donbass.
- I don't understand. Would you please expand on this?
  
  They're referring to the fact that the war actually started in 2014. 2022 was only a military operation and it has only last year been finally referred to as a war by russia. So yeah, russia's been struggling in Ukraine for quite a while. They thought they could pull another Georgia 2008, I guess. Can't blame them for trying now, can we? It's only their historical territory and nazi territory that they're trying to take so it's ok.
- The fact OP and all the liberals in this thread ignore on purpose.
  
  Ignore Ukraine fighting Russians who invaded their country? I thought that was the point?
  Are you trying to stand by the bald faced lie that 'its just locals who disagree' over booting out the extremely corrupt Yanukovych? Just locals with Russian military tech shooting down MH17.
  I'm sure the oil and gas discoveries prior to the 2014 invasion had nothing to do with it.
  What really blows my mind is the tankies ignoring Ukraine trying to nationalize the energy sector ahead of Russia's invasion.