Have we overcomplicated everything?
Have we overcomplicated everything?
Have we overcomplicated everything?
It's overcomplicated because it's not immediately easy to keep the smart functionality totally local to your own network.
Almost every company that sells an IoT product wants you to make online accounts, download their special app, sign up for subscriptions, download useless firmware updates, and have all the hardware connect externally with their mothership cloud servers in order to function, all because they want to run a data harvesting racket disguised as an "ecosystem".
I'd use mechanical switches in the house, but at the same time, yelling at Siri to turn on my lights for the third time is the closest thing we currently have to sexbot servants. I only have so many years left on this planet, and I wish to embrace the future now.
That creepy as fuck having companies sell to data farms your normal everyday habits.
Like when you turn on and off the lights or open your fridge.
Home Assistant + ZigBee devices.
My rule for smarthome stuff is that it's self-hosted, and it has to have a low-tech way to use it. A light switch can be on Zigbee attached to my Home Assistant server, but it needs to function as just a light switch when the network is down.
Have some old stuff that doesn't follow these rules, but I'm slowly replacing them.
All fun and games when a grey hat hacker "hacks" his way into your living room through your window and starts turning on your lights without your permission.
I recently bought a zigbee dongle to use with a home assistant VM. Do you have any advice on products? There is alot of stuff out there and I am trying to make sure I get good stuff.
My current plan is that id buy assorted types of lights to fill the roles of actual lighting and mood lighting, and I would pair that with a 4 button switch to toggle between some different presets. Been looking at Moes for the scene switch buttons and Sengled bulbs, and still need to find a solution for having home assistant to turn on or off non-smart items by delivering power or withholding, but i feel like i am flying blind.
IKEA has a lot of cheap, yet quality stuff you can use. The best thing for me is that they are nearby, and things like switches and buttons are super cheap.
There's the Sonoff ZBMINIR2 device. You install it between a physical switch and the wiring, and then tuck it into the electrical box. It has three different modes:
I have a couple, and they're great. They just don't support dimming.
I mostly use the Enbrighten Zigbee Dimmer. Its dimming function sucks--you have to hold the paddle down until it's around the setting you want--but otherwise it works pretty well.
I will never use smart technology. I prefer analogue technology. Imagine using a subscription in your home for lights and TV and AC and heat and appliances and then boom, they decide to terminate your subscription and now your home is inaccessible for habitat.
There are ways you can set up a smart home without subscriptions, for instance using Home Assistant. But most people somehow chose to be stuck in these cloud apps with subscriptions. Ring, with a subscription for a doorbell, is wild to me.
You already have a subscription for water, electricity and heating. Your parents had and your grandparents too.
Honestly I'm fine with smart technology. As long as I can homebrew it or something ;3
I've had my Phillips hue bulbs for over 10 years now. I own like 20 bulbs and have only had a single failure. Never had any issues with the bulbs. Google Assistant however has let itself go.
"it just works!"
I've had a similar setup, and bluntly, their not the brightest bulbs, and they're not the best bulbs, but they are one of the easiest to set up and get working. They mostly just fire and forget....
I hate the saying "it just works", but hue, despite all of its shortcomings, just works.
I've had at least one bulb fail outright, started illuminating "white" as an off purple color? It's hard to describe. I have no idea why, but that went into the bin. I also had one bulb that was in-between uses, fall and smash, I think it still works but it has sharp glass on it, so that's probably going to the bin. I have one other bulb that's failing right now... This one is... Different. It blinks. You'll have it at a steady, full brightness (or whatever) and the bulb will just shut off for 1/10th of a second every few seconds. No idea why. It's probably headed to the bin. Luckily it's in my hallway, so I don't see the problem most of the time.
They're expensive, and you don't get a lot of light per bulb considering what you pay for them, but they are easy. That, in and of itself, would be the main reason I would suggest to anyone who isn't a complete nerd, to get hue. Anyone with enough technical prowess and the willingness to set up home assistant, should probably go to different options. Anyone too busy to bother with their lights and just wants something that they can control with their Google home/Alexa/Siri.... Hue is a good option.
Not saying there aren't other good options, but hue is the one that I know and would suggest.
The flashing one sounds like a ballast issue (these are LEDs right?) and the weird purple could be caused by a dead LED in the group that if it was working would balance the color to white.
Since they're expensive you'd hope they wouldn't have these hardware issues... But I'm also just guessin.
their not the brightest bulbs, and they're not the best bulbs,
There is a joke there somewhere
How’s the security on those light bulbs is a weird but valid question
I had issues with it from the get go. It wouldn't accept my pairing, it was blinking on and off all the time, etc. I threw it out as soon as I didn't need it for a couple of hours. Why do they need so much info to run a bulb?
I think hue works so well because it's based on the ZigBee standard and the hub which is a dedicated appliance for controlling the lights. WiFi and Bluetooth should be reliable but with cheap lights maybe that's the issue.
I bought Ikea bulbs and the only time I've ever had an issue with them is after a brownout nuked the gateway/hub device.
If you let the wireless remotes run out of battery you have to re-sync them, but beyond that they're the easiest IoT thing I've ever used.
Google home assistant has gone to total shit. That new Gemini crap will not recognize commands the the old assistant has no issues with
I like smart tech, as long as I can make it work for me and not just another data vacuum for some faceless corporation. I've got Home Assistant handling a lot of my stuff now, and I'm moving things over to it and replacing corporate-app-only things with things that can work locally.
I'm interested in doing this also. Is there a guide you're following, or would recommend?
Home assistant has been on a push to be more user friendly. It's gotten quite good, over the last few years. It's not quite to mass deployment levels yet, but it's managed to wrap all the evil parts in easy to use interfaces.
The best bet, to play with it, would be a raspberry pi. There are premade images of home assistant available to install. Stick one on as SD card, and follow the prompts. You'll be amazed at what it can just find on your home network.
Yes. Yes we have. This is why the internet isn't fun anymore. I use YouTube like 20th century folk used TV. But at least I have control over my shit in that case.
Most people use YouTube without an addblocker. In which case, your content comes with about ten times the amount of advertisements than if you'd have used a TV back then.
While we're at it: I remember when opting into adds was a choice for creators on YouTube. Quite a few refused, even popular channels. Can't imagine growing up with this shit now and thinking it's normal.
I used both Firefox, but after foxfire had some shit with selling info I went back to using brave. Brave has the best youtube ad blocker ever.
And yes, I am aware that brave has its own info stealing shit.
Edit: I remember the 20th century. Yes I am also aware that ads now are worse than back then. Back then you had an ad or two per show and it was good for them.
I need to state that I grew up in Dubai. TV in Dubai had a strange way of putting ads in stuff if you were a European or north American who came down there. On most TV shows you had spots that were made very specifically to insert ad breaks without creating any jarring break in the show. Mini cliffhangers, mildly awkward moments, or even in some cartoons they would have a 'we'll be right back after these messages' announcement.
The TV operators in the UAE either ignored them, weren't aware of them, or just didn't care. They would put ads right in the middle of nowhere. Sometimes even when characters were speaking and the ad break would start, cutting them off midsentence.
The absolute worst one for me was actually in 2001. They aired Digimon in Dubai and during a particularly riveting transformation sequence with a whole song and stuff they cut off the thing in the middle for a dumb ad. The better time would be just BEFORE the sequence started.
Yeah I'm never buying those bulbs again. Learned that lesson years ago.
Being able to change colors from your phone is neat but let's face it, you're going to have it on the same setting forever anyway.
Maybe once I start selfhosting I'll fuck with HomeAssistant but till I control what connects to what, how, and why, I'm good.
I like using the smart bulbs as part of my wake up alarm. HomeAssistant starts fading the lights on 10 minutes before my alarm is set to go off.
I bought the bulbs before Hue made accounts mandatory, so I blocked the bridge from all internet access, and it never got the update. If I ever need new/more bulbs, I'll be just buying some generic zigbee bulbs.
If it's just dimming you could go with dumb dimmable bulbs and just make the light switch "smart".
Apparently modern dimmers just PWM the power so it wouldn't take much to make something that does that. I assume LED bulbs work nicely with dimmers by now.
Hue bulbs are just zigbee. You can get an offline zigbee hub, plug it into Home Assistant, and control it without needing the Hue hub anymore. Then just keep using your existing bulbs and buy generic zigbee ones as needed to replace when they fail.
I bought the bulbs before Hue made accounts mandatory, so I blocked the bridge from all internet access, and it never got the update.
jus a liddle “fhack hueeee” 😎
Matter over Thread is generally what you should look for. Local control is always possible, and it'll work with any major ecosystem.
You do need a "Thread Border Router", which you likely already own. If you're tech inclined, Home Assistant is amazing, though it takes some tinkering.
Echo (4th Gen) Echo Show 8 (3rd Gen) Echo Hub Echo Studio Echo Studio (2nd Gen) Echo Plus (2nd Gen) Echo Show 10 (3rd Gen) Eero Beacon Eero Pro Eero 6 Eero 6+ Eero Pro 6 Eero Pro 6E Eero PoE 6 Eero PoE Gateway Eero Max 7 Apple TV 4K (2nd generation) Apple TV 4K Wi-Fi+Ethernet (3rd generation) HomePod (2nd generation) HomePod mini Nest Hub (2nd generation) Nest Hub Max Nest Wifi Pro Nest Wifi SmartThings Hub (v3) SmartThings Station Aeotec Smart Home Hub
I haven't reconnected all of my smart-bulbs in over two years because every time the software updates or when I have to change devices I have to reinstall everything all over again and find my account information and reset my password and all that, and it's fucking absurd and I am done with it.
Fuck voice controls, it was fun at first but there are switches on the wall, I will keep using them.
Maybe in a few years some AI program will be released that actually works and can be used to assist with home-control and it will just work autonomously, but I doubt it. These companies have zero intention or motivation to produce things that make our lives better, they go halfway by making something "cool" we want to try, but don't make efforts to make the new, cool things actually work better and more efficiently for users. No need, if they already buy the thing, then line goes up and that's all that matters.
I have one WiFi bulb in my house near the entrance to my office. I turn it red to let my housemates know I have a meeting without leaving my chair.
This is about the only reason I could see for a WiFi light bulb. I could wire something but that’s a lot more work.
It is more work, but imagine how cool you would feel with a big red button on your desk that you hit to turn the light on!
Do you manually set the light bulb to red or do you have some kind of automation?
I tried to set up an automation with home assistant, because I use it for everything anyway.
But getting the information "You're in a call" from microsoft is impossible, if you can't create an "app" in order to get an api key, if the company sysadmin doesn't want you to have it.
You can go from blue alert to red alert without changing the bulb.
Yeah, I want smart switches w/ manual override, not smart bulbs. I can maybe see those smart bulbs for accent lighting or something, but definitely not for the majority of the lights.
The cheap ones we got have a fallback to 50% brightness warm white, if you turn them off and on again twice within a couple of seconds. Without that I doubt I could live with them either.
You wont regret starting with HA. It's awesome and the possibilities are endless.
Just to mention a few of my use cases:
... So is this all worth it? Maybe not. Probably not. I'm pretty confident that I would be happy without any smart bulbs in my home. The inconveniences regularily outweigh the conveniences. But the conveniences do exist, and there are times when I am very happy to have them.
Hass is awesome, but not something you'd probably use instead of an actual switch, I use it for my leds in my office where it makes sense.
I'm of the mind that Home Assistant should live alongside your lights and everything. They should still function without it, but function better with it. Like my lights are all still controllable from normal light switches, but with Home Assistant they change color temperature and brightness throughout the day with the sun.
I build my own smart lights to avoid this kind of bs. Thanks to ESPhome i didn't even need to program them myself. Everything is in an offline VLan and connected to Homeassistant.
Everything is in an offline VLan
This is the way.
I don't need ANYONE to control my house when not in my house, and if that means I don't get to either, then oh well.
I find it funny how people who are not working with any kind of electronics are the ones who have smart homes, smart bulbs, smart keys, smart tv's. People who work in it have nothing connected to the internet, except their own server with a hammer next to it.
Oh I can control my stuff remotely. After connecting to my VPN that is.
I have been looking into this kind of thing. My impetus is wanting to connect my Android alarm clock to Home Assistant and set it to trigger my espresso machine to power on 30mins before I wake up. I saw ESPhome recommended for the smart plug. I'm sure I'll find other uses once I set it up though, maybe even building my own light bulbs.
I use it to slowly turn the lights on 20 minutes before my alarm goes off. It's great fun
Building a home assistant at the mo...our main impetus was a Flood Event in the basement brewery lol
ESPhome
First time i'm hearing about it. Sounds very cool! Would you mind sharing your setup and how it works?
I've got a Sever running Homeassistant with the ESPHome Addon. The Lights got a custom PCB in them using a ESP32 and a 4 channel warm/cold white led strip driver. But you can also build them using of-the-shelf parts. They are mains powered without a switch, instead i wired the switches to a sensor input. This allows me to control the light either via the switch, or Homeassistant. They even got some buttons directly on them to force them on/off if my server is down. I also got a radar in there for presence detection. Basically the same as an infrared motion sensor, but it doesn't turn the light off while im on the toilet. Thanks to using Homeassistant, I can change the color temperature and brightness of the lights depending on the time of day. It's really nice to have some dim and warm lights in the evening before going to bed.
But ESPHome isn't limited to some custom build stuff. Anything that uses an ESP32* chip can be flashed to run ESPHome instead of whatever it came with. I got some sonoff relays that control my shutters and an Emporia Vue 2 to measure my power usage. Depending on the device you might be able to flash it either via Wifi or you have to disassemble it to get to the programming pins. The nice thing about the ESP32 is that a vendor cannot lock the firmware. You can always flash something custom.
ESPHome isn't limited to Homeassistant however. You can also have each device run a web-server to control it, or connect it to MQTT.
Also i should mention some alternatives:
There must be simpler ways than every bulb having a network interface...
Maybe, if it were up to me the entire control system would be centered in my electrical panel. But doing that after the fact is quite difficult.
That technology would be okay if it was 100% open source, and came with a hard-copy manual alongside purchase so I could write a Python script to control it from my PC. Then and only then would I consider deploying such a technology in my home.
You just described home assistant. The only part not open sourced is the firmware in the device you want to control.
Zigbee device + zigbee usb bridge and you can talk to the device directly or via an MQTT abstraction layer provided by another open source service. The MQTT way makes it even easier to do.
Thanks for the info. I'll be looking into that.
I refuse to buy appliances that need an internet connection to work.
The pursuit of the almighty dollar has enshittified too many things! Bring back useful, well made things!
The thing with most of them is that I really don't understand why I need remote control of half of the white goods in my house. Why would I need to remote start my washing machine and dishwasher. I still have to load the fucker. I'll just set a delayed start.
Why does my kettle need to boil on a schedule. It takes 2 minutes while my toast toasts.
About the only thing I understand it for is central heating. It would be quite nice to have a nice warm house for when i get home but even then, I can just set a schedule on a typical physical dial.
No need to sign in, poke holes in my network security, and give my information over to get another company that can get hacked and leak my data anyway. I'm not a Luddite but 90% of this stuff just feels like a pointless waste of money for minimal utility, reduced reliability, and compromised security.
My parents had the same washing machine for 40 years. When they replaced it, 2 of them died within 10 years after the control pcbs got wet. You'd think they'd protect against that seeing as it's going to be in a fucking washing machine.
I mean, you can do a lot of stuff without relying on technology, like doing the dishes in the sink or washing clothes in a river. This is just another step. But setting up a kettle to boil at a specific time isn't the only thing these smart homes can do.
The only "smart" light fixture I have has its own separate remote for switching between modes and adjusting light. I will never buy a device that either needs Bluetooth of Wi-Fi.
Most of the best globes run on ZigBee or equivalent!
!lemmysilver
!lemmysilver
!lemmysilver
My phone lets me listen to over 10,000 different songs.
How many different songs do you listen to each week?
Oh, I just play my 15 favorites on loop.
I blame Spotify for its crappy algorithm. I have over 2000 songs on my liked list and shuffle gets me the same 30 every day.
yeah, same here. i think their algorithm must select the songs that cost them the least amount to play at that time.
It's not just theirs, I swear every fuckin streaming service has made the most dogshit algorithm of all time. If I have a playlist of 100 songs, and I hit shuffle and repeat, I expect a list to be generated with each song in a random order that will get played through until each song has been played once, and then ideally a new randomized list is generated to listen to the same 100 songs again in a different order.
For every streaming service I have used so far, my experience is that it'll just pick a cluster of maybe 10-15 songs, and cycle through exclusively that until the algorithm either decides you want to listen to something not on your playlist, or the internet connection breaks for a second and the algorithm just gives up completely on randomization.
Don’t let ‘em
https://stevenaleong.com/tools/spotifyplaylistrandomizer
(What’s the worst that can happen, Spotify account/credit card stolen… publication of all listening data… I am paranoid, still trusted the guy and his tool for Tru-Ly Random Playlists)
…assume not True-Random Truly �_
Their recommendations thing is still relatively new and developing, but I love listenbrainz recommendations. You can set it up to follow your music listens on multiple different music streaming apps (and locally too, I think). It made it easier for me to bite the bullet and cancel Spotify.
If you don't like it, stop using it. There's no one to blame but yourself.
Clear your cache. That supposedly works.
all 10,k at once.
I have over 6,00 songs on Media Monkey. I let them play at random while I'm cooking. Often I will skip one if I'm not in the mood and sometime I will delete one. Varity is the spice of life!
Not sure, I usually listen to DJ sets on soundcloud
But can your normal lightbulbs ddos a Minecraft server?
You underestimate the electromagnetic emissions of cheap knock-off led bulbs!
okay fine i'll get some
The only smartbulb feature I need is dusk-to-dawn for my porch lights, and I found lightbulbs that actually have it builtin.
Good old electronics that don't depend on the cloud.
I did this with a string lights, a smart plug, and a home assistant 'sun' integration
The first thought into my head was that you're somehow doing PWM by directly switching mains electricity.
Fancy. I just have a dumb switch that does it offline with any bulb. No dimming, though
I do this with a USB relay, it doesn't use any radio communication but the downside is it requires some rewiring
I just have my porch lights hooked up through The Clapper and my computer uses a local weather feed to trigger sundown mode and play a clap sample through my Bluetooth speaker array.
/S, but now I kinda want to do it.
Reminds me of that post
“My room mate asked if I could unplug his book so I can charge my cigarette, the future is stupid”
Are the persons a little mixed up?
I have shitass intelligent bulbs. In case of lost connection, they work like standard bulbs via , you know, switching lights on or off via switch. Wtf. Also app allows me to connect via bluetooth and just requires me to be on the same wifi.
Cheap intelligent lightbulbs apparently are better xD
Yes, we did.
The kind I have, worst that happens is I can't change the color or warmth of the light until I am reconnected. They still work with the switch going on or off, and they are set to return to default color/warmth settings when the fixture they are in is physically turned off so I also won't be stuck with rave party disco lights.
Two options is plenty, especially without apps. Who is getting rid of switches?
This is what the Unabomber was trying to warn us about!
I don't agree with this... I use Govee everything and control it through Google .. I can't imagine forgetting a Google password. I don't care much about privacy on my lighting control. Yes everything is over complicated but pick a brand and a control device and you're fine. Before I consolidated I had 4 different lights and controlling apps and if I messed up a stored password I could easily reset one of them using an email addy ...mostly disposable ones
The post the other day about charging their something with their couch and 10 yr old them...
Back around 2011, I remember reading a headline along the lines of "Samsung Galaxy 2 receives Google Android Ice Cream Sandwich on Sprint" and understood it completely while also thinking that just 5 years earlier that I'd call 911 if someone said that because they were clearly having a stroke.
Charging their doorbell with their couch
OMG! We have meta, I'm so excited guys!
I'm reminded of GE and their unintentionally hilarious video about how to factory reset their smart light bulb
Is this real?
It shouldn't be. Usual smart bulbs let you use the light switch. Unless you somehow removed the analog switch, though, maybe?
But the switch needs to be in the on position all the time for the smart bulb to work. I'm pretty sure I tried turning them on like normal bulbs at my sister's and it did not work. You need to do the "Alexa turn on x"
I mean they might need to log in to reconfigure their settings, not just turn them on and off. It's the meme made after the fact that assumes he doesn't have a switch lol
Just turn them on with the switch.....
I keep telling people to quit buying this shit and stop using corporate social media. But they're scared that lemmy is a virus (shrug) and only trust daddy google and apple
I added my heated socks to Home Assistant so I can have them turn on when getting out of bed because I have a pressure pad under my mattress to track when I get up.
Frivolous automations is the way! I have a WLED strip go on 5 pm when a wheely bin needs to go out, with colour matching next day’s bin collection.
"Does the pole count as part of the traffic light...?"
Do the bulbs that are off in the picture count?
Is that an issue?
We still have switchboards... Don't we?
Not if you forget your password
I've been using mine for about 6 months after switching phones. Haven't even set it up yet. Switchboards don't need verification
The one I have in my bedroom blinks like crazy if it gets desynchronized with the cloud and that happens all the time
That would make for a good alarm mode synced to your phone. Strobe lights + screamo music is all I need for a good start to the day.
Never had a problem with password resets. e-mail-based 2FA and being unable to change the attached e-mail, OTOH...
Who buys this?
IME, about 90% of the twats at Reddit/r/smarthome. They they whine when the next Sonos or such they switched to gets bricked yet again.
I do. Had mine for 10+ years and can't live without it now. It's amazing to not have to remember to turn on your outside lights, or to set your lights for a movie.. or if you forgot to turn off the lights or...