Don't forget where we came from and what shaped us as a species. The Jungle.
Don't forget where we came from and what shaped us as a species. The Jungle.
120 comments
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\ Nature according to people who use that argument- Well if the ants can do it, why can't we?
(Btw, I'm opposed to caged chicken egg cultivation, and even had my own chicken in the past before I couldn't anymore for eggs. Now I just pay the premium and researched which were the most ethical eggs in the store available. Happy hens make better eggs anyway. I'm just pointing out we're not the only ones that raise animals for consumption in nature).
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Why would what ants do have relevancy to what we should do?
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I invented a fictional society for stories in which you are allowed to buy and consume meat, but only if you have a “carnivore’s medallion”. The only way to obtain one is to have witnesses observe you personally slaughter a living being (eg, a chicken) with no assistance.
Ideologically, seems like a good way to put friction on meat obsessions and get people to think about it.
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Sounds interesting.
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If they went to live naked in the woods and used their apex predator canines to tear out a deer's jugular, I'm not judging.
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Veganism isn't about respect for nature. It is a philosophy and way of living against animal cruelty and exploitation.
Congratulations on a legit shitpost.
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Whoosh.
E: For those downvoting, remember this is a shitpost and some level of inaccuracy is almost required. It's the shit part of the post. Like, c'mon guys...
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Lmao. Look at OPs comments. They actually believe this shit. Based on all the other shitposts they post here and all throughout lemmy, they probably picked it up on reddit or some other trash site, thought it was funny, and came here to share.
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does this look natural to u?
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I can side with the vegans that the meat industry needs to be clamped down on hard
But eating meat in of itself is not wrong, that is what is natural
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99% of vegans dont say eating meat in itself is wrong and this bullshit narrative needs to stop
Edit: I wrote "in itself" to make it especially clear, but it seems people are skipping that part. The act of eating meat can not be evil, carnivorous animals do it for survival. The context is always what matters.
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Pretty horrifying if you let yourself think of it.
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This is for real shit post
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As much as I admire the morality and overall health of vegetarian/vegan folks, I would also super respect anyone who got all their protein by monstering whole live mice that they caught by hand.
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I'd support a "you can eat all the meat you can catch and kill with your bare hands" diet.
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Our ancestors have been using sharp sticks, heavy sticks, and sharp rocks since they could walk upright, so I’d support that, too.
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I’m vegetarian and my partner is vegan but neither of us are strictly against the “hunter and gatherer” approach.
Where I live traditional hunting is almost nonexistent, but fishing and other ocean-based “hunting” (crabs, crays, oysters etc) is super popular. I’ve considered taking up spearfishing as it’s more intentional than throwing in a hook and dragging up whatever, and requires more (in my opinion) skill and nerve to pull off successfully. But even if I actually caught something the thought of cleaning it puts me off and I’d more than likely ruin it and waste a life for nothing.
No issues with anyone that can fairly catch and prepare their own meat for themselves, but I’ll stick to my tofu and seitan for now.
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Great, now I have to replace all my beef with veal.
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Vegans and vegetarians are not often more healthy than meat eaters. In fact a lot of them subsist mostly on junk food and ultra processed shit.
I dunno about their morals. For me it depends on whether they are opposed to meat because they think it’s murder (absurd notion: see op) or because they opposed the treatment of living animals in industrial meat farms, which is the real issue.
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There is not only a treatment problem, but also that livestock eats a lot of calories that could be used elsewhere
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However you gotta justify your choices I guess.
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I'll take "things actual vegans never say" for $500!
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it's not even a contradiction. One can respect something and not emulate it.
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Not a vegan, but I don't think I've ever heard a vegan say that. We've all watched nature shows. Rationale is usually a little bit deeper. Overconsumption, abuse of animals in meat/dairy industries, responsibility of humans to aim for a higher level of morality than animals, etc. Sure some go overboard, but I wouldn't underestimate the complexity of the thinking behind it.
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There are too many people for us all to hunt our own meat, and the same amount of farmland that can feed x amount of livestock can feed significantly more people than the livestock would.
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Not all crops are created equal.
Crops intended for livestock are way easier to farm, require less water, less pesticides, less fertilizer, and less taking care of.
Many times crops intended for livestock are a necessary part of rotatory crops. As they tend to be easier on the land.
Farming is not as easy as "you can grow anything in any given land".
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Falcons didn't fuck up by inventing tofu, so they have an excuse. We don't.
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Except its scientifically proven, that our possibility tonevolve was Not from Hunting, but agricultural Farming. But great Shitpost
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No it wasn't.
Otherwise humans wouldn't have been smart enough to figure out farming in the first place.
Also humans were already humans when farming was invented. We're not pokemon.
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the first crop was rare candy and evolution stones
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Don't fucking tell me what I can and can not be!
With the power of friendship I will finally become a Glurak (also screw English Pokémon names)
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Modern humans are around 300.000 years old .... we've only been farming for 10.000 years. Doesn't quite add up.
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That's not how evolution works. Evolution doesn't have a plan, it doesn't wait, or speed up. Evolution just happens and our human ancestors would have continued to evolve regardless of agriculture. The path that evolution takes could have been very different but it would have happened. The human species is still evolving and will continue to do so until it's extinction.
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Hawks eat meat cause they have to. WE eat meat cause it's delicious. The Hawks dies if there are too many Hawks in one feeding ground. The human fucks up his and everyone elses Habitat for centurys cause he's too lazy to change.
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A balanced diet with some meat along with fruits/veg/nuts is the most healthy for most people.
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Some people just don't feel comfortable killing and eating animals. Let people live their own lives.
Anyways, less people eating animal products leads to lower prices for those who do (you).
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Temporarily lower prices. A large consumer base is needed to support the infrastructure that provides meat food products. More people eating more meat will normally produce lower prices in the long-term.
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It may be made up for in quality though, having a smaller consumer base may result in ensuring higher quality meat on average. Perhaps even a situation where lab grown meat is used for things like hamburgers or chicken nuggets.
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It's way easier for me to have a vegetarian diet when I'm eating at home. At restaurants the vegetarian options almost always contain the one thing I'm allergic to, so I often have no choice but to eat meat when I go out.
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Actually, I believe current thinking is that we came from grassland, hence the advantage of upright walking.
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Depends on how far you go back. Grasslands came after jungles/forests.
Based on some of our traits (nose shape good for diving, can control our breathing voluntarily, fingers get more grippy when wet, lack of fur), we might have even been semi-aquatic for a while.
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Source on the semi-aquatic part? Looking it up only brings up the aquatic ape hypothesis which is pseudoscience.
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I read The Jungle in highschool. Not good book about food.
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And the angel of the lord came unto me Snatching me up from my place of slumber And took me on high and higher still Until we moved to the spaces betwixt the air itself And he brought me into a vast farmlands of our own Midwest And as we descended cries of impending doom rose from the soil One thousand nay a million voices full of fear And terror possessed me then And I begged Angel of the Lord what are these tortured screams? And the angel said unto me These are the cries of the carrots, the cries of the carrots! You see, Reverend Maynard Tomorrow is harvest day and to them it is the holocaust And I sprang from my slumber drenched in sweat Like the tears of one million terrified brothers and roared "Hear me now, I have seen the light! They have a consciousness, they have a life, they have a soul! Damn you! Let the rabbits wear glasses! Save our brothers!
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The first time I ever heard this was the night that album released. Lived in a house in Cape Coral Florida with a bandmate, and a few members of another local band as roommates.
I think the other band’s drummer had gotten it earlier that day. Anyway… later that night, we pretty solidly cooked and listening to it, and when the album ended, no one wanted to get up and start it over or put on something else… so we all just sort of quietly sat there.
And then, after a looooong silence, we heard this….
I swear to god- no one moved an inch, no one said a word. We were absolutely floored! What the hell were we hearing! Visions of a white haired Amish preacher, glasses swinging from a chain, as he stomped through a farm plot, yelling at us….
Needless to say… Minds were blown that night.
Such a good memory!
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nom
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Plants can cry/scream. Checkmate, plant eaters.
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So, after reading a lot of the comments, I figured I’d offer my two cents:
What I eat depends on what I feel I need at the moment a lot more than what I’m in the mood for. And because of this, I try to eat as healthily as possible and as a result- it usually ends up being on the vegetarian side of things. Think pastas, fruits/veggies, etc. Occasionally though, it’s a burger, or something else that is meat-based.
What I don’t do however, is spend any time at all being concerned with what others choose to eat, and that is because it has no relevance to me whatsoever.
For the life of me I cannot understand why this is a thing that matters so deeply to so many people when there are FAR more important things to worry about.
If vegans don’t want to eat meat, who cares? They are happy living their life this way. Leave them alone about it. It’s their choice, their diet- and none of your business.
If someone wants to eat a steak, who cares? They are happy living their life this way. Leave them alone about it. It’s their choice, their diet- and none of your business.
The sooner we all stop actively participating in the habits and interests of others unsolicited, the sooner we can start taking on some of the things that actually matter.
/rant.
EDIT: Realizing now the mistake one makes when trying to remain neutral in a discussion where vegans are involved. I really tried to be neutrally supportive of one’s dietary choices, and I remain so, but man… these few people are making it difficult to not see how people can find them obnoxious.
I’m sorry I really didn’t want to be made to feel this way for having tried to make a civil statement of opinion.
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What omnivores eat should actually matter to vegans because theyre responsible for stress and suffering, which many see as their moral obligation to oppose. Funny how its mostly the other way around.
Imagine people going around raging about how you dont beat your wife and kids or dont rape and kill children.
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Also the environmental impacts. I don't own a huge polluting coal powerplant that is actively contributing to fucking up the planet that I live on, and I'm still allowed to criticise them for it. Why should the meat industry be any different?
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As I already stated, I’m not getting baited into a morality debate.
If you don’t like eating meat- don’t eat it, but leave others alone about. It’s not your business what they choose to eat.
And WTF? This has nothing to do with beating kids, or raping children, and I don’t appreciate the disgusting false equivalency you feel you need to use in order to make a point.
So instead, here’s an actual equivalency:
Imagine people going around and telling you that you have to do something you don’t want to do because of their belief. Like for instance….
forced birth.
You are actually telling people what they should or should not do, based on how you morally feel about something.
What I’m suggesting, is simply a dietary version of pro choice. You should be free to eat how you feel you need to in order to satisfy your needs, as well as your moral code- provided it remains within the limits of the law. EVERYONE should have this freedom. Even if you or I don’t like it.
So maybe leave people alone about it and put that energy towards something that has a better chance of success
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Not vegan, but to play the vegan’s advocate—vegans are acutely aware of the level of cruelty in the factory farm system, as well as it's affect on the environment and don’t want to partake in those systems of harm and taking without consent. To them, it’s not just a dietary choice but an ethical stance against suffering and exploitation. To someone who sees the life of a cow as just as sacred and important as a human's, you can imagine why it would upset them to see you eating a steak. Just like you might be upset if you saw someone eating a dog or a fellow human. To them there's no difference.
It’s similar to how evangelical Christians genuinely believe they’re trying to save people from eternal damnation when they get preachy. Just as annoying. The difference is that one is rooted in observable reality—documented animal suffering, environmental damage, and ethical concerns—while the other is a matter of 'faith.' and the latter is given a lot more leeway. So when vegans speak out, it’s not necessarily about policing your diet; it’s about trying to reduce harm in a world where harm is often hidden or normalized. And for what it's worth I have known a lot of vegans and not one of them was ever preachy or judgemental, in fact most tend to keep it to themselves because vegans are so often the subject of ridicule, the butt of played out jokes, or made to host a session of 20 questions and feigned health concerns from people who eat nothing but processed meat and carbs.
I believe everyone should be able to do and live as they want as long as it doesn't interfere with anyone else's ability to do the same, and I can fully understand how to a vegan someone eating a steak would break that rule.
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And if a vegan wants to help that by abstaining from animal-based products, that’s awesome for them, a great and healthy thing to do, and I wholeheartedly support it! But they don’t need to be telling others that they must do it also.
They have make the effort to put the info out there, and did their part by staying true to their own beliefs, and it should stop there. They shouldn’t be getting involved in the decisions others make on what to eat or what to buy any more than anyone should be telling them they are wrong for their vegan ideology.
That’s all I’m saying.
I will not debate the moral implications as that is not relevant to the point I’m making and is a different discussion altogether.
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Don't get all logical, their heads may explode.
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OP's argument is a fallacy so common it has a formal name. But I don't want to get "all logical" and put anyone's scalp at risk.
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Watch out the one vegan with the finger strength left to press the downvote button is gonna come for you.
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And another one will report his post. They are surprisingly oversensitive 😂
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I dated one for over a year. Mentally unstable that lot. I think the whole time she was introducing me to people I only met like two vegans that I would have considered mentally sound.
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120 comments