5d ago

framework 13 AMD... yay or nay?

hi,

pretty much the subject... I am trying to choose my next laptop and I am tempted to buy a framework 13 AMD. I saw this post from one year ago : https://www.phoronix.com/review/framework-13-amd

and while the review is impressive, comments are not. how things have evolved since then? any experience?

EDIT: you convinced me, I just ordered mine. Thanks for the incredible answers !
NEW EDIT: I use arch (btw), and Gnome. For the answers, I do not think this will pose a problem but... what do you think?
(and yes, I ordered mine before reading last comment of paequ2 who doesn't like it... for reasonable reasons, maybe. I hope I will have more luck ;) )

84 comments

I just bought one a couple of months ago. It’s my daily driver. My work issued laptop sits on my desk, and I carry my framework around. If you’re a Linux guy, fedora runs fantastic on it - everything works, couldn’t be easier. Battery life could be better, but it’s fine. Trackpad is great, I heard some bitchin about it, but I don’t get that hate. Some complaints about the hinges and how they bounce. Again, unfounded complaints in my opinion. The hinges are stiffer to open/close than I expected, but they are fine (just a little different feeling). New webcam is great for a laptop webcam. New screen is nice - but let’s be honest, not much touches an apple screen. Sound is ok, nothing special. The case is fantastic-people (engineers and nerds) drool over it. The swappable ports are awesome, that alone makes the laptop imo. But the real star is the serviceability of it. Five screws and the whole thing comes apart. Everything can be replaced and upgraded. They even give you the screwdriver you need to take it apart. Bios updates work with fwupdate in Linux and they update regularly. Keyboard feels good. It stays cool and fans don’t go crazy.
It’s expensive. But I love mine. But I do plan on keeping it and upgrading forever - or at least until I smash it accidentally, so maybe it wasn’t expensive.
The 13 doesn’t have a gpu. It’s capable, but if you want to game on it, look at the 16. If you have specific questions I’d be happy to answer or post a vid/pic or something.
- I'm sporting a Framework 16 since a few months and had some battery problems at first. Due to work load, I couldn't really get into the problem and something I changed or updated resolved it.
  But I sent a mail to framework support at that time and the answer was just awesome.
  Not just some typical 1st level response to update or restart, but real technical questions and obvious interest in my problem.
  They even sounded a bit sad, that I couldn't really tell them anything, because the issue resolved without me being able to pinpoint it.
  On that note, I also have to say, that Tuxedo support was really good.
  My Pulse 15 battery was starting to get a belly, and they sent me a new one without much questions - and no pay.
  Now, after like 4-5 years, I have my old Pulse to my nephew and saw that the CMOS battery is dead. Again they just sent me a new one.
  Some companies really deserve to get recommended.
- I read through those comments - there’s actually more complaints than those. Those weren’t that bad.
  They updated the fan curves recently, mine runs fine. Fans aren’t silent when humming along, but normal use they aren’t even spinning.
  Sleep is always a bitch on Linux. It doesn’t have great sleep life. I just shut mine down at the end of the day, and close the lid during the day.
  I believe they fixed the amd graphics issues. I should have noted that I have a core ultra chip. I wish I had gotten the amd chip - but guess what - no biggie, I can upgrade later!
  There was a complaint about the windows key. I will admit that I ordered the Linux keyboard and it pissed me off that I got a keyboard with a windows key. But I didn’t make a stink, I just deal with it.
  There was fingerprint reader complaints. Mine just worked. Dunno what that was about.
  My vote is a firm “buy a framework” and get a fun color. People will be jealous.
  
  The linux keyboard has a Windows key?? What's special about it then, that makes it a linux keyboard and not a windows one?

I have a Framework 13 AMD running Linux Mint. It works great and I love it. Modular IO ports are super nifty.
Here are the downsides as I see them:
Price
No touch screen
No wifi 7
I expect 2&3 will come in the future and I can upgrade! The fact that I can upgrade rather than throw it away in the future offsets 1.
- Can you not use an M.2 wifi card? Or do wifi 7 cards not exist yet?
  
  According to Framework support, there are no supported models as of yet.

Yay, It's always gonna be Yay

I've been trying to sell mine. Went down to 60% of the original price and no takers.
My tip: Don't take funny-colored borders or funny keyboards unless you're 120% sure you don't want to sell it in half a year.
- Still trying to sell? Would you ship to aus?

YES! Big yes. I have one as well. Very pleased with it. Be very sure you pick the new 2.8k display version. So either pick 7640U - 2.8K Display or 7840U - 2.8K Display. Which works great for Linux, WITHOUT the need of fractional scaling.
Also be sure to pick the correct + right amount of expansion cards for your needs. 1 USB-C will be used for charging, so just saying.
- Then if you installed your distro of choice, be sure to install power-profiles-daemon for improved battery life. So the chip goes to a lower power state. More info: https://knowledgebase.frame.work/en_us/optimizing-ubuntu-battery-life-Sye_48Lg3
  
  Apart from that, everything else should just work fine out of the box under any modern Linux distro most likely. The only downside I had with my Framework 13 laptop is the sound quality, because the speakers are down firing. You might like that or not. But you can definitely live with it.
  
  Hmmm... I've been using Bazzite on my FW16 and it's been running great. They have a distro image specifically built for Framework, and it's been great in terms of power management.
  I wonder if that stuff is covered in the Bazzite FW installation? Anyone know? I guess I can check...
  
  is ppd better than tlp for amd? because I still use tlp for all my devices (intel) and it works really well
- I’ve been stuck deciding between getting the 2.8k screen and upgrading to the larger 16 laptop. I stopped using my desktop last year entirely and so now I’m trying to figure out whether I should go with the larger laptop since it’s the only thing I use now.
  
  I personally like the 13 inch format laptop, since I use it as a laptop.

I can speak to longevity - I have a gen 1, batch 2 (humble brag?) - and absolutely love it. Got me to switch over to linux, and the quality is there. Minor gripe about the trackpad sticking intermittently, and had to have the hinges replaced (both known issues, resolved). 10/10 great laptop
- Minor gripe about the trackpad sticking intermittently
  Aaaah!!! It's not just me! I used a track pad on another computer and realized the Framework's stickiness wasn't just in my head!
  
  Oh dude no, it's a headache! I wrote to them once and they said it was an issue with the balance plate/sensor.
  Apparently the quick fix is to click the bottom center of the trackpad 5x, then test it (I do so by clicking top corners). I find it hit and miss haha. Going inside, you can adjust the placement of that plate, but I never found that useful.
  Did you notice if it seemed to improve a bit with time?

i have the intel one, i love it.
it matches with my definition of laptop, portable, 2k screen, the battery lasts a lot and a bit touchpad.
i have kde 6.x so i also have TouchPad gestures.
- Ooh I didn't know that KDE has touchpad gesture support now, I'll need to give that a go next time I try linux

I have had that laptop a couple weeks and have been loving it. On fedora, everything pretty much just works flawlessly with no effort. I had a small issue figuring out how to turn off secure boot at first (f2 at boot time I think?) because that menu was separate from the rest of bios.
Other than the speaker not being great (not surprising) and the battery life being meh, it's a very impressive machine. Mac laptops for me have always been the gold standard for smooth operation but I despise apple, so when I got this machine and it felt mostly like the smoothness of a MacBook pro with the freedom of Linux, I was super stoked about this laptop. It feels very snappy and the keyboard and touchpad are great.

I'm super picky with laptops and have a bunch. Thinkpads, Macbooks... Framework 13 AMD is my daily driver that I prefer over all of those. It runs brilliantly with NixOS. I would buy it again in a heartbeat.
- Hey, funny that you mentioned the Thinkpad. I'm between getting a Thinkpad and the Framework 13. Would you perhaps share things that for your personal preference were downsides in the Thinkpad?
  
  My T14 is a great machine. The keyboard is excellent, and its Linux support it great, too. However the screen is pretty bad and has a bad ratio for coding, it always looks dirty because its black shell shows all the oil from your fingerprints. If something breaks out of warranty, you're pretty much SOL. Whereas with the Framework, I can upgrade and fix any component, up to and including the mainboard/CPU.

So I have a Framework 13 AMD with Mint. Framework on older firmware isn’t the best, but with Mint 22 and by extension 24.04 it’s fine.
Got mine back in December and had no issues with the installation process. Games play fine though the fan goes to 100% after a bit. But with power profile in 22.1 it can quiet the machine down.
Other than that and the occasional hiccup. Compared to other laptops it’s the best machine I’ve used. So far no issues with only a few times of opening the terminal to fix minor issues.

I have the AMD edition and overall the laptop is nice but since I received the laptop about 9 months ago the screen broke 4 times. I only got it back 2 or so weeks ago from the repaircenter so I have only been able to actually use it for a few weeks. So my experience is pretty terrible so far. I honestly have no faith the screen is durably fixed this time but let's see, I'm pretty done with it.

I can actually game one the AMD one pretty okay. Couldn't with Intel. Battery life also increased by 30 minutes.

I recently picked up a Framework 16 (AMD with GPU to replace an aging gaming laptop used for travel) and love it. Linux (OpenSUSE Tumbleweed) works wonderful. Thinking about picking up the 13 when I need to replace my other laptop when it's time for that.

I have both the 13 and the 16. Absolutely love them.

I currently own a Framework 13... and... after daily driving it for a year, I decided I don't like it.
The deal beaker for me is the high dpi display. Linux just isn't 100% compatible with hpi displays. I'm tired of my apps either having blurry fonts or tiny text. Ironic because hi dpi displays are supposed to look better.
With Framework, you'll be pushed into using Fedora (it doesn't solve all the scaling issues) or pushed to stop using apps you like because they're using older GTK (some times there are no alternatives). You'll also have to dive into debugging scaling issues.
I just switched back to my Dell XPS 13 9310 FHD and it was a breath of fresh air having everything just work. Any distro, any apps, no scaling debugging, text is readable and crisp, app UI elements look properly sized.
I only ever switched out the modular ports once, but honestly it would have been better to buy a dongle instead because that would work on any computer.
Oh, and I tried the higher resolution screen. It didn't fix the scaling issues.
Oh, and, I actually had a display fail on me! After like 8 months, half the display went black. Thankfully, they were nice enough to send me a free replacement, but it definitely left me feeling like the Framework isn't that sturdy or durable.
The shell also dents easily. I dropped a small music player from desk height onto the top lid and it left a small dent. (I have like 3 dents on the lid.)
Repairability is the one feature that the Framework beats everyone else on, but to me the cons outweigh the pros.
- Framework 16 with the same display and linux mint user.
  Pushed towards fedora? What? I also have no issues whatsoever with the screen or igpu of amd, so i wonder what you were using there and with what chipset.
  Ive been daily driving mine for nearly a year now ( amd chipset and igpu) and none of those issues at all...
  
  Here's a screenshot I just took from my Framework 13. Notice how some of the text is clear, but the entire menu to the right is blurry.
  
  Common "fixes" are "move to Fedora" or "just enable some experimental flag in some random config". This all misses the point though: I don't want to have to do any of that. I just want a system that works with the most amount of apps.
  Of course, it depends on what you specifically value. For me, I value broader software compatibility over slightly neater pixels. Some people might like it the other way around. That's fine, but it's something important to know.
- I had the same display failure, but 4 times in about 9 months. It made me pretty done with the whole thing. I only got the laptop back from the repair centre 2 or so weeks ago but I have no faith the issue is properly fixed now. Let's see how it turns out, if it happens again I'm going to throw this thing out of the window.
  
  This was my failure.
- I have a linux desktop with dual 4K screens and I don't have problems with high DPI? The only problems I've come across is with Wine which is easly fixed within the winecfg.
  I'm on OpenSuSE, using KDE in X11. I DID have scaling problems with Wayland which I avoid until it is fit for daily use.
  Of course 4k is 4 times 1080p (or twice in X and Y dimensions) so maybe it's much easier to scale to? 2K on the Framework is an odd resolution so maybe scaling would be more troublesome? 1080p to 1440p would be 1.3x scaling.
  
  I don’t have problems with high DPI ... only problems I’ve come across is ... I DID have scaling problems with Wayland
  This is exactly my point. You did have problems with high DPI. You had to fix some random config and avoid Wayland.
  I don't want to deal with this. I want to be able to use whatever software I want and have it work with minimal or no extra "fixing". I value this over slightly neater pixels.

I was like batch 5 of the AMD framework 13 running Arch and Gnome on it.
I did have some problems with suspend/nvme drive that was fixed by replacing the nvme. If you go with their drive you'll probably be fine (I just grabbed one I had laying around). Ever since then the laptop is perfect. If you do get it check out the Archwiki article that has a lot of helpful tips for tuning your OS to the Hardware

I got mine last January and it's been pretty much flawless on Arch with KDE and Wayland. No regrets whatsoever. Battery life is probably the only weakness, but I also push my stuff hard. Overall, I'm super satisfied with the choice.

Have had one for about three weeks no (13" and), and it's fabulous. Habent had any issues. Running fedora 41. I love it.
- Describes my experience exactly! I'm liking Fedora

I bought one last summer and the only problems I've had were some display issues which were solved by adding kernel parameters to disable all of the amdgpu power management (which as far as I can tell doesn't even increase power usage noticeably). Other than that it has been basically perfect and way better than any other laptop I've had. I wish it had real suspend, but that's just not possible on modern CPUs so that's not Framework's fault
- I've seen an S3 option in Smokeless_UMAF, so maybe you can enable real suspend, but I haven't tried on my Framework 13 AMD.

Yes, of course. Check for a refurb on sale though from the official store. No sense in paying full price for a 2 year old reference.

I have loved my AMD framework . 3:2 aspect ratio took awhile to get used to but I love it now. Only thing I need to figure out getting the USB c ports to work but everything else has worked flawlessly
- What are your issues with usb-c ports? I've got one on each side (so I can charge from either side), and I haven't taken them out or moved them since installation, and they've worked flawlessly... Are the modules themselves bad?
  
  Both USBC ports work fine for charging and USB but they do not work with my thunderbolt doc

The comments didn't seem bad to me. Some people were complaining about an HP laptop's power efficiency, but the framework's is fine. Also, the intel ones have noisier fans, but the amd is perfectly quiet in daily use. I have two real complaints with mine: while the power draw is low in use, it uses idle sleep, so it doesn't last that long asleep (longer than awake, so a few days to a week). You can of course power it off for longer term stuff, and boot times aren't bad so that really isn't a huge issue for me. The other one was a bit of a pain until I found the solution. All of the integrated amd GPUs from that gen have a problem on linux where they randomly get buggy and the whole ui drops to like 2 fps. It is resolved with a kernel parameter (sounds complicated but takes 5 min and a reboot. I will edit this with the steps when I get to my laptop). The frameworks generally improve over time. I wouldn't get a 16 yet, but my brother and I both got 13 amds several months ago and are very happy with them.
Edit: Nearly forgot, it came with an "AMD" (mediatek) wifi card. I replaced it with an ax210 as soon as I got it and would recommend you do the same. Amd requires laptop manufacturers to put the amd card in but it kinda sucks IMO.

Does anyone have experience running the 13 with linux and an eGPU by any chance?
- Via TB4? If I'm not mistaken Oculink eGPU adapter is only possible with the Framework 16. It may worth waiting to perhaps get the new Arrow Lake with a discrete TB5
  
  yes, that would be via TB4 for now...
- I can confirm the Intel version of the Framework 13 works amazingly with an eGPU (Fedora). 11th gen was my daily driver until I upgraded to a Framework 16 😎
  
  nice, that sounds great

I've been using a framework since the first edition they've released and it worked great. Theyve only gotten better since.

I've got a 13 with Intel Ultra and it's a good machine.

Don't think you'd regret it. I can't speak for that one in particular, but I'm still running one of the DIY Kickstarter versions. Will probably replace it with another Framework (or maybe even just upgrade the components if I can).

I've found linux support to be stupendous. I am running fedora silverblue and I can't think of anything that didn't work out of the box.
Even the fingerprint sensor!!!
Framework has really great forums and pages dedicated to linux. I even get firmware updates through ufw no problem.
Great build quality, amazing repairability, performance for the price is pretty decent. The keyboard is even pretty good.
It's probably one of my favorite laptops I've ever used.

I too am considering a framework 13, and am wondering the same. Hopefully someone will give some insight.

I've been cheering for Framework more or less since they first started shipping machines. I'm on MacOS and only use Linux on NUC-style machines and VMs, but if I was ever gonna buy a non-Mac laptop, I'd go to them.

I ran into some minor issues with mine running Fedora 41, all had workarounds.
Sometimes the ports stop working properly, I have to pull out either the USB-C or USB-A expansion card and plug it back in and its fine. Scared me the first time it happened before and a reboot didn't fix it.
I ran into full-system stutters that were actually related to PSR. I had to add amdgpu.dcdebug_mask=0x410 (remove the underscore, the word filter got a little overzealous) to my kernel command line since I couldn't listen to music without stuttering. Fascinating that the display having PSR problems caused audio stutters, but here we are. It's weird that others aren't running into this, but whatever. My battery life is worse with it off but at least the computer doesn't stutter anymore.
Obviously only some of the ports support USB4 so I run USB-C on both back ports and USB-A on both frontlier ports.
edit: can i just say that there are fewer more negative places than Phoronix comments, in general. I wouldn't take them too seriously.

For people with experience with any mobile 12th gen intel and the framework 13 AMD, can you quantify what you think the upgrade is worth or would it be better to wait for a refresh to the "ai" series if that ever happens.
I look at the price for board/ram/wifi upgrade and struggle to justify even though I expect the amd cpu to be cooler/quieter and have much better iGPU. I know it should easily outperform the steam deck in raw performance so with some scaling it should be reasonable for some light casual gaming but I don't have any experience with amd outside of desktop cpus and dedicated graphics. Every time I consider an upgrade it makes more sense to buy desktop upgrades and cope with the intel system for a few more years. I don't have a good use for the intel mainboard as it doesn't have much expansion, multiple ssd, pcie etc.

It's probably good if that is the sort of thing you are after, a laptop just isn't something I want to spend real money on myself.

Yea*

I've had one for a few months now and it works really well. The only issue that I've had was that I expected Linux to run well on it, but it seems like AMDs Linux support has been overstated, and gnome would crash entirely when browsing certain websites like Tumblr, I assume because of some poorly supported video format. Everything runs fine on windows and it's been a solid laptop so far. Obviously it's not going to be the best for gaming, but the integrated graphics will handle lighter workloads fine and I'm hoping that it'll save me money in the long run from the much cheaper cost of repairing vs having to buy a new laptop after 5 years.
- What distro has given you trouble on gnome? I've had mine a couple weeks and it's been pretty solid on fedora (gnome)
  
  I've mostly tried Fedora 40, I gave it another quick go after 41 with no improvement. Given that most other people haven't experienced it, and I've only had this issue with Tumblr specifically and no other website, I'm guessing that it must be an uncommon codec.

84 comments