https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE

This is long but worth the watch. It is a lawyer and a police officer giving specific details on why you should never talk to the police.

This is bad advice. In all cases, dont talk to them.

Rule 1 : Don't

Rule 2 : Am I being detained?

Rule 3 : I will not answer any questions without my lawyer present.

Be as advised, in the US, if you are driving your car, you are required to identify yourself to an officer, along with providing proof of registration and insurance. Remember, you can beat the ticket, but you can't beat the ride.

Man this thread is full of people asking to get jerked around by the cops. "AM I bEiNg DetaIneD?!" Well, you definitely upped your chances.

Here's a life lesson: don't act like a fuckwad to anybody and your outcomes are likely to be better across the board.

Good advice. Think about the situation and get a feel for what's going on, instead of automatically trusting or hating cops. It really isn't smart to treat real life like a meme.

This is mostly a copy-paste from my comment in another post, but:

Dont literally not talk to the police.

Example: If you are at a car crash, and you literally remain silent and don’t verbally deny fault, the cops will assume its your fault (since the other driver will obviously deny fault) and the police report is say “[Your name] is at fault”, and that’s gonna fuck up the insurance claims. Always deny fault (but don’t make up false statements in the process of doing so).

Also, if you are in the US, and is a suspect of an alleged crime, don’t actually literally remain completely silent. You have to verbally invoke your 5th amendment rights to protect against court shenanigans.

Excerpt from wikipedia:

In June 2010, the Supreme Court ruled in Berghuis v. Thompkins that a criminal suspect must now invoke the right to remain silent unambiguously. Unless and until the suspect actually states that he is relying on that right, police may continue to interact with (or question) him, and any voluntary statement he makes can be used in court. The mere act of remaining silent is, on its own, insufficient to imply the suspect has invoked those rights. Furthermore, a voluntary reply, even after lengthy silence, can be construed as implying a waiver. The new rule will defer to police in cases where the suspect fails to assert the right to remain silent. This standard was extended in Salinas v. Texas in 2013 to cases where individuals not in custody who volunteer to answer officers’ questions and who are not told their Miranda rights. The Court stated that there was no “ritualistic formula” necessary to assert this right, but that a person could not do so “by simply standing mute”.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution#Explicit_invocation

Just say a simple phrase such as “I hereby invoke my 5th amendment right to silence, and I want to talk to a lawyer”. Or if not in the US, just leave out the “5th amendment” part.

(also, might be a good idea to have a few phone numbers of criminal defence attorneys memorized)

Maybe you want to go as far as “Were you shoplifting?” “What? No. That wasn’t me, man.” ... do your best imitation of someone who just fell from the sky. “So you’ve NEVER MET your neighbor. Your neighbor across the hall.” “Nope.” “Are you sure?” “Yeah, I don’t know.”

Wrong.

Don't tell the cops "I don't know" or "I didn't see anything," or anything of that ilk. Don't try to plead innocence. Don't try to use logic. It will only ever work against you, and it will never work in your favor. Always always always always.

Just tell them you exercise your right to be silent. Over and over again, if necessary. That is all you say. Be a broken record. There is no situation where you are actually obligated (in the US) to answer any type of questions for any type of law enforcement, at any time, for any reason, ever. That's all you need to tell them. You don't answer questions. You don't answer why you don't answer questions.

This is because you can also be prosecuted for lying to them, and their grounds for accusing you of lying can be pretty shaky but you still might get convicted. You can't be prosecuted for saying nothing.

Note that this will not prevent them from lying to you, which is legal, and making spurious threats of arrest or similar to attempt to intimidate you into complying. Be aware that this is automatically bullshit. At worst the can hold you for up to 48 hours (-ish, state laws vary on that point somewhat) without charging you with anything and even if they do, you still don't have to say anything to them.

If this happens, lawyer up immediately. You can sue them afterwards if it comes about that they violated any of your civil rights in the process.

In light of all of the above, I don't deal with the police at all.

Name and if necessary, driver's license. That's it. That's all I'm legally obligated to provide in my state, and even then only in specific circumstances. If they're on my actual property they can pack sand; No warrant, interaction. I won't talk to them, I won't even answer the door. If they want to try to bust in illegally, what happens after that is on them.

I will further never, ever call the police for any reason. They simply can't be trusted. If I have a problem with someone or something, I will solve it myself. The cops in my area have near as makes no difference to a 0% clearance rate for nuisance crimes, assault/battery, thefts, and burglaries anyway. Unless you need a report for insurance purposes it's useless, and at that rate I'll have my attorney call them on my behalf. They are not in the business of helping you. So don't even expect that they will.

TL;DR: Don't talk to the police.

Don't EVER talk to the police.

Also, never answer the question, "Do you know why I pulled you over?" with anything that sounds like an admission. They're fishing and looking to have you confess to a traffic violation.

The honest answer is "No, I'm not sure why you pulled me over," because it's true. There are a million motivations they might have come up with to pull you over, and you're neither psychic or telepathic.

There's a really big problem with this guidance. You may be in category 2 (i.e. a suspect) and not know it. They may also retroactively place you in that category, and everything you said can now be incriminating evidence

Bad advice

Don’t talk to cops unless you are legally obligated to do so. Depending on the state you may have to identify yourself, and in some locations and contexts provide identification. You should know your local laws. In my state it is not required even if detained although in practice refusal to identify just means you aren’t going home for a looooong time. You do have to give your license if you’re stopped while driving, of course, but you do not have to answer any other questions other than signing the citation. The aclu has a website clearly outlining what you are required to do in each state including wallet sized cards with the information

Real police advice: if they’re giving you shit shut the fuck up. If they’re arresting you just go with it. You aren’t going to win. They’re going to call in 900 back up units and 2 helicopters with thermal imaging and a tank to track you because they’re basically an army now. The more you resist the more likely you die and become a sad headline that people post and forget about in 20 minutes. They aren’t trained to take you down safely. They aren’t trained to de escalate. They aren’t trained to control their anger. They will often get furious if you resist their authority and take out that aggression on you with extreme violence. They will slam you to the ground, choke you, punch you, beat you with their knock off tonfa, taze you repeatedly, and restrain you in ways that are dangerous and restrict your breathing. They will outright ignore you if you plead for help or become unresponsive. They will let you die, wait 5-10 minutes despite being on camera, then call for medical who will take another 10 minutes to respond to your long dead corpse that could’ve possibly been resuscitated 15 minutes ago if they hadn’t stood around doing nothing like ghouls. They have 0 serious repercussions for this behavior, at worst they’ll get shuffled around

Let them arrest you, shut the fuck up, and fight it in court. Unfortunately you will need resources to do this and pretty substantial ones. I just hired a lawyer to process documents for a subpoena against a client in my healthcare practice. It was a fairly simple case of document review and it cost $2300. Probably took him 45 minutes of actual work, if that. The system is unfair and rigged against you.

Real real police advice as a result: avoid them at all costs.

Do not talk to the police.

https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE

sticking to “am i being detained” and “lawyer” works wonders got out a fucked situation with the first. Genuinely the biggest gang in the US, treat them as such

This is absolutely shit advice.

You are not obligated to talk to the police. The 25 word script:

• “Why did you pull me over?”
• “I’m not discussing my day.
• “Am I being detained or am I free to go?”

If you are being detained, invoke the 5th amendment.

I had police called on me once. I was working for a homeowner while they were out of the country, and one of their neighbors called the police to report me being in the homeowners backyard.

I was watering their plants, by the way. But their neighbors might not have known or seen that since the backyard is behind the house and a fence.

Anyways, police showed up and took a few steps up the driveway to the side of the house where I was working and asked me if I was the homeowner. I politely said "No, I am not the homeowner." The officer gave me a look, to which I elaborated "I work for the homeowner, they are currently on vacation in [country name], and they asked me to water their plants for them." I was holding the water hose in my hand and the plants were wet on the side of the house he could see.

He was also polite, asked me for my ID which I presented, he took a picture of it on his phone and then took some notes. He asked me to hang out around the front of the home a bit because I think he may have been relaying information to dispatch, but then he came back and shook my hand and said "Thank you for being cooperative, I was on a call with the dispatch who told me the person who reported you said the homeowner was on vacation in [country name]. I don't want to take any more of your time, but hope you have a nice day and I already let dispatch know if anyone else calls about it to let them know you work for the homeowner." And that was that.

Be polite and respectful. Don't lie or be untruthful. You might not like the police, but they are still humans, treat them like humans. Purposefully making their job harder will never, ever end well for you.

Every citizen can choose for themselves if they wish to remain silent, and if you choose to do so you must say specifically that you exercise your right to remain silent. If you have to speak to the police for whatever reason after you said you exercise your right to remain silent, you are legally obligated to say you will continue to exercise your right to remain silent if you choose to continue to do so.

The third option is our German chancellor (Olaf Scholz). "I dont know where these Millions went." "I don't remember anything about that incident." "I don't recall sending or receiving these messages." "That evidence? No I don't remember this and I refuse to talk about it" If you ask any uncomfortable questions about corruption he just stays silent.

Something for everyone: keep your license and registration/insurance in your sun visor, keep a state ID on you for ID purposes. Also keep your hands on the wheel until they are at the window. That and keeping the information in the sun visor ensure that your hands are in plain view the entire time. You don't have to suddenly start moving and digging around in a dark compartment. Police officers are trained to keep their eyes on your hands and if they can't see your hands they get nervous and that's when bad police officers start pulling guns and shooting people. Sounds stupid but it's what they're trained to do. Following this simple and straightforward advice will immediately de-escalate and improve your interaction with anybody pulling you over. I've actually had officers mention it after a stop and thank me for keeping my hands in plain view etc. The vast majority are just trying to do their job, and this advice makes it easier for them, makes them less fearful, makes them less prone to do something stupid.

I actually got that advice in a very nice concealed carry class I went to. A large portion of the multi-day class went over interactions with law enforcements what to do what not to do etc.

Another YSK post only applicable for US citizens?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjvdHE1E5eI

Another helpful phrase: "Am I being charged with a crime or am I free to go?"

Why not post to a cop forum "how to deal with the people you have to deal with." ?

Because most of us haven't taken classes about the book "On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society" while most US cops have.

oh right, of course. this guide is for interacting with US police. as if the rest of the world doesn't exist and we should all assume that everything posted to the internet applies specifically to US citizens. cool thanks

Terrible advice. Please, check this guide from Projet Évasions (PDF warning) instead.

Cops are not always the enemy or the maniacal whole-job-is-making-evil thugs that Lemmy sometimes makes them out to be.

Yes, they literally are. All cops are bastards, always, everywhere, forever, no exceptions, no matter what they are currently doing or have done prior, and capitalism is always evil, so their whole job is in fact making evil, and anytime they do something beneficial is an accident. If a person puts on that uniform, they're a worthless piece of shit. End of story. Individual cops can stop being pieces of shit by burning the uniform and trying to fix the lives they have broken.

It really is bad for people to get mugged or their cars broken into, and they're the solution our society has come up with to minimize the amount of it that happens. It's not always a bad thing.

Emphases mine. I'll take them one by one:

• Cops were and are imposed on us by the capitalist class. Any consent ever expressed for these monsters has been beaten into us by generations of police violence and then solidified by propaganda.
• That is not their purpose. Their purpose is to maintain order for capitalism. Historically, modern police forces descended from slave-catching patrols. In interrogations specifically, their purpose is to gather information to build up a case file. The presence of police does not deter crime, and the deterrence of crime is only a pretext for the police to do what they're actually paid to do.
• Interacting with cops is always an immediate personal danger, especially after you have been hurt or are vulnerable, because they are unhinged monsters who will send you to the morgue if you make them too uncomfortable. You might decide to make that choice to interact with them to prevent some greater evil, for example being courteous during a traffic stop to prevent the cops from detaining you for being suspicious. But at the end of the day, we must recognize that any interaction with the cops is always treacherous.

If you find yourself talking to the cops, there are more or less three ways:

They're there to solve a real problem.

No they aren't, they're there to enforce the will of the capitalist class. Practically , they're there because they either think they witnessed a violation of the law, or because someone called them. Rarely do they even attempt to solve problem, and in the rarer circumstance that individual cops do solve a problem, it is because they betrayed their actual function as cops.

Someone's car got broken into, someone got beat up. Just talk with them. Tell them what you know, help them figure out the situation.

No you fucking don't, because that cop will likely use your evidence to go after someone who didn't do it. They don't stop crime, they don't solve crimes, they only provide information to the judges and terrorize the streets while doing it. Don't help the cops with property crimes.

In almost all of the US, their effect on the problem will be positive

Use your judgement as to whether that's warranted of course, and your impression of the justice level in your local area, since it varies quite a lot in the US.

Don't use your judgement, use the judgement of the victims! If they don't want the cops involved, then they don't get involved and that should be the end of the discussion.

The same applies with any type of federal law enforcement, I suspect, for the next few years.

It has applied for the entire existence of the modern police, and it will continue to apply as long as police exist. The guide I linked was written in 2022. Yes, we need to hammer this point over and over and over until people understand that no administration, even the so-called lesser-evil party, will ever be on their side except perhaps by accident.

I was going to post this as a comment, but it was in an anarchism community, and I figured some sections of it might be unacceptable there.

Rightly so, because it's terrible advice and it's clear to me that you haven't sought out any wisdom from the community. What you should have done was asked for critique. We would have loved to talk about this in more detail on any anarchist forum.

In my view, it is so much more important to listen to people as an anarchist (or any kind of revolutionary) than it is to spout off my views, hence why I don't really post that often. Even this comment I expect and hope to get torn to shreds in the hope of improving the quality of my understanding of the world. So next time, please actually solicit the advice of your comrades before making statements, and in general do some research before making posts like these. Hence why I have started this comment with a link to a guide solicited from a group of anarchists.