Is it improper to do "Disengage" too early in a discussion?
I'm just middle aged and lost all energy for unproductive discussions. The second another poster posts something genuinely hostile, like "touch grass" kinda shit, I'm just done talking. Also if we're six comments in and the other guy won't even admit to being wrong to the thing he said on comment one, despite me doing twenty minutes of research to prove conclusively that he's wrong, I don't want to waste another second of my life on him.
I gotta have 10% of the "disengage" comments on this site.
Hot take, I think the "disengage" rule is good but I don't like the way we do it.
Saying "disengage" sounds like your commanding someone to disengage, which comes off as a final "fuck you!" It's basically a mod enforced way to have the last word. If we instead said "I'm disengaging" or "i want to cease this convo", idk something that had more to a tinge of humility to it I think it could come off better.
if we instead said "I'm disengaging" or "i want to cease this convo", idk something that had more to a tinge of humility to it I think it could come off better.
Its absolutely enforced when we see it happen. Report any instance of the disengage rule being used improperly like that. We don't see everything and rely heavily on user reports to point out CoC violations
There's also the issue where someone will write a multi paragraph response then add disengage at the end to ger the last word in
That hasn't been an issue for over a year. Doing that will - or at least was - grounds for a banning. I know because I'm the one that asked for the rule to be clarified so it didn't work like that.
There was some drama with some user who kept doing it, which was the motivation for the rule change/clarification.
You know I tried something like that recently, but the people who need a disengage aren't the ones to take a hint. It's a command because the people who's hobby that day is to argue with you aren't going to respect polite boundaries.
Okay but I've seen as many examples of people using it as a "have the last word spell" than as a way to tell someone who's legit been pestering you to fuck off.
I'm pretty sure spamming someone with replies after they've asked you to stop is against the rules anyway so you could just report them.
Can you explain the disengage rule? I think this is the first I'm hearing about it and that's kind of weird/concerning because I feel like I should know the rules of this place.
If you want a conversation to stop, especially with a user who's constantly replying or following you. You can respond with "Disengage.", and the user is obliged to stop posting at you about whatever it is. The post has to be a simple 'disengage', rather than trying to get the last word in with "you stink and here's five reasons why also disengage".
Saying you want to disengage isn't just for you, it's also a signal to the other person that you have no interest in talking to them and they shouldn't waste their time either, not just yours. If they respond to a "disengage" with some smug comeback, they're just wasting their time.
It feels like Hexbear is warmer than other places on social media. But I have this habit of scrolling past long comment chains, so maybe I'm just missing it.
Does blocking prevent the other person from seeing and replying to you? Or does it just stop you from seeing them? Thanks.
Also do note, if you block a user, you will also be unable to view any replies to comments they make (but the 'xx more replies > ' link will still show and their comments will show up towards the post comment count. It's a glitch I believe but it's a weird artifact that kind of reminds you of the person you blocked, and can hide legitimate comments you would like to read. (I'm relaying this from what I've heard, I haven't blocked anyone)
Some of them reminds me of my time working in a kitchen. You have one or two of those psychoes who get spit on the bosses or customers and they lash out at the juniors of the crew.
Absolute control freaks with a napoleonic complexe
I wish blocking worked better, you can still see when blocked users have replied. And blocked users can still see and comment on your posts all the same, doesn't feel nice.
And blocked users can still see and comment on your posts all the same, doesn't feel nice.
As long as you don't actually see the comments, I would say this is a good thing because you can see the loser coping and seething at your comments while you've long since moved on with your life.
Set whatever boundaries you need to set to have a healthy relationship with the site. Replying “disengage” is just a signal to moderators. As much as it’s been established as a social norm so that it doesn’t come off as every time it’s used, it was established as a way for moderators to enforce disengagement. If someone isn’t harassing you, you can just not reply. That’s always fine and okay. Unless you’re forming personal relationships with people here somehow, the person ideally won’t even notice because they’ll have a handful of other threads they’ve commented on anyway.
Without naming names, I've got in arguments with some users who will just keep coming back and posting more replies after you stop responding. Sometimes for days, in one case, weeks.
I also think there's some value in actively signalling that the conversation was actually really sucky and you hated it. Helps steer people in nicer directions, I'd argue.
Life is short. I can't imagine you being on your deathbed lamenting the fact that you routinely refused to go 12+ comments deep with someone who was being obstinate and arguing like its bloodsport.
Nah, i wouldn't even comment that i disengage, i'd just ignore it.
People aren't always gonna be online and able to reply to stuff, much less have longer discussions and i think most people understand that. sometimes i feel bad for not replying to people who replied to me because i went offline for a couple of days and didn't see it, but that's just part of communicating on a site like this.
I just get bored of long struggle sessions when there are so many other things I want to do. If someone wants to keep it going after a few replies I'll stop responding
(Seriously no, and particularly not after you've done a modicum of research and the person you're arguing with just finds a handful of other issues without addressing the main point)
I gotta have 10% of the "disengage" comments on this site.
I think your well-being deserves that percentage if that's what you need. You owe nothing to assholes, pedants, or smuglords that would otherwise wear you out.
Is it improper to do "Disengage" too early in a discussion?
I'm just another Internet random but, FWIW, I don't think it's improper.
I read something recently that I think is relevant.
It was just someone else's hearsay, not a quote from a philosopher or someone famous or something, but worth paraphrasing here.
It went something like, "nice people are nice because they don't have patience for bullshit."
The context was an explanation that having boundless patience for, e.g., unproductive arguments, isn't being nice—that's just letting people walk all over you.
Being nice comes from the mental tranquility of knowing that you will not hesitate to walk away from unproductive pursuits.
I honestly think that the there's no real point in having it around. If you want to end a comment chain just don't reply. If a user is spamming a comment then that already violates Hexbear TOC. The only thing "Disengage" does is allow that user to have the final word. If you try to make any point beside "disengage" then I feel you're abusing it to end a discussion without potential backlash. In this scenario, you're literally still engaging with the other user but you don't want them to engage back.
Disengaging should either require you don't respond to the final comment or it should allow the other user to respond to the points made in the disengage comment.
I think you're right, but we're talking just "disengage" not "here's a 500 word essay why you're wrong now disengage". Another user suggested a nicer way to put it, and I think it's fair.
I admit, it can be a passive aggressive way to end a convo. But a final end to a convo can be good for mental health. Like you're right but there's some good to it as well.
Now that I've typed that all out, please DISENGAGE from me!
If you want to end a comment chain just don't reply.
The argument is some people don't have the self control the extricate themselves from toxic conversations, so giving them a way to, albeit ungracefully, have the last word is the only way to stop them from stupidly getting their BP up over an angry internet shitfit.
I'll be honest, I don't think we should allow someone to be passive aggressive just to save them the stress. If they're going to rage over the internet they'll find something to be mad about eventually.
You're not getting paid for this. You're not even a volunteer. You're doing this (presumably) for recreational purposes--because it makes you feel good. You don't owe anyone anything. Disengage when you're not getting what you want out of it.
Think of it like real life. You're at party having a discussion with somebody that turns into an argument. If the person you're talking to is an asshole - there's no point in talking so why keep talking? Just walk away.
I don't think there is ever a wrong time to disengage from a situation. You don't owe anybody the time and mental energy it takes to continue the discussion at that point. Especially on the internet, where there shouldn't be an expectation that the other party is ever coming back to the discussion, just close the tab and move on.
bespoke: blocking them after writing your 10 paragraph reply, getting fully around the 'disengage = getting the last word in spell' issue and never having to think about the other user again
You can do that IRL too. Don't like something? Just leave. As a BJJ coach, whenever I'm teaching about double tapping to submit I go "it doesn't matter if you don't feel like you had a submission, if they get bored and decide karate is better, you just let go and let them go out the door"
Nope. Never too early, if you know you're dealing with some peckerwood smuggard what won't be turfed out, it's easier to just shut their shit down from the jump. "No, I'm not interested in discoursing with you, go away."
IMO the only thing Internet discussion is good for is sharpening your arguments for yourself. As a general rule I don't reply to replies from shit I said yesterday ever, and if I am in it with someone I'm only doing it because I want to see how my own thinking will get poked at by someone else. Sometimes even libs can poke a hole in my argument that makes me stop, think, and read more on a topic - but usually not, so if I'm not getting anything more out of a thread I just disengage myself from it.
so i kinda ended up vomiting some personal stuff here so uh just a heads up
i used to be kind of a huge dickhead. i mean, i've got a bunch of Brain Problems & I think my egg was starting to crack, so i ended up having this stupid reactionary phase that just feels super surreal when i think about it. but i think about it a lot, because my favourite pastime was yelling at strangers online. i was actively feeding my anger because it was basically the only thing i had. i think about it a lot, because i must remember that i had completely lost track for a while there. & now my brother is going through the same thing, except it's far worse because of the post truth bullshit. his are only getting worse. like, what am i supposed to say if someone says it's a proven fact that women have never been treated as lesser BUT ALSO that women only have rights because men gave it to them
sorry. this is kind of a long ramble. but the point is, all this stuff has kinda led me to taking a more passive role in my interactions. i disengage & block v often because my being upset is a full body experience. i know i need to curate my media consumption with my mental wellbeing in mind, so even if a comment is pissing me off because i 200% know they're full of shit, i just move on, because it doesn't matter what i say to a person whose worldview is all vibes / projection. they see themselves as the Good & Reasonable People, so naturally anything that challenges their views sets them off. they're just not playing by the same rules at all & i'd rather use my energy on something constructive instead. there must be millions of people like i used to be & i gotta understand that not all of them can be helped.
I think it has its place. We're a small community, i see the same names around. I've seen op plenty for example, and subjectively never seen you use it. I've parsed it as "something to use when I've got my hackles up with someone i otherwise like."
To the point on people using it to get a lady word in, I've used "disengage" like once myself when i got too hot in here, dunno if i used good tone when i dropped it but disengage per se is neutral
I think the only time I'd raise an eyebrow would be if the disengage was the first reply to a comment (three comments total: yours, the reply to your comment, then your reply containing "disengage").
Don't waste your life energy on random internet users.
Also consider that like 90% of the internet is bots at this point, some (let's be real, most) of which are deliberately designed to manipulate you or make you angry.
I suspect that even on lemmy, the more populous instances are filled with bots. Not the more tightly moderated ones, like this one tho.