why is everyone who immigrated from a communist country to the us a fucking chud?
why is everyone who immigrated from a communist country to the us a fucking chud?
i go out of my way to experience different cultures and it seems like the immigrant communities in the united states originating from communist countries tend to be some of the chuddiest people imaginable. chinese, russian, cuban, vietnamese. literally every person who i ever talked to that has lived in a communist country and then moved to the united states, or is like second or third generation from that, tends to be incredibly reactionary and anti communist. i feel like i am a more well versed communist when talking to people that lived in a communist country.
its like that everyone that comes to the united states from a communist country forgets the values of marxism, socialism, and communism. i have been too polite to ask what really made these people move to this fucking shithole and if i had to guess they have something severely wrong with them and they want to participate in some small business tyrany and become capitalists. like all these assholes be chasing the dollar and they bring great shame on their own nationality even being here.
i have had much better discussions with people from countries that are still being exploited by capitalists since they already have an understanding of what colonialism and capitalism even is and they arent here to try to become small business owners or worse. people from puerto rico dont got the brain worms that cuban expats do for example.
and i should mention, they all state, they love their country but they blame everything bad with their country on communists. It infuriates me hearing these people, who were born in a nation with socialized healthcare, state controlled industry, basic welfare for citizens, just trash talk the system that make them so successful in the first place and gave them the resources they probably didn't deserve to open up a shitty restaurant selling borscht. they would know exactly why these social programs cant meet demand if they just took the blindfold off and realized that america, the great fucking satan, is the reason why the global economy is so unequal ITS ALL BECAUSE OF FUCKING AMERICA NOT COMMUNISM YOU STUPID FUCK!
ive been told not to view myself as more communist than others, but i fucking am around these parts with expats who are not communist whatsoever, that makes me more communist than them. if i was to draw a hundred mile radius around myself odds are there probably wouldnt be someone more communist than me. nobody in my life reads theory, every fucking time i tried reaching out with dsa or the bernie shit i have only met shitlibs, i have found no comrades in bipoc communities, the lgbt, religion, or labor. just having someone say to me face to face they are a communist would help me anchor my belief system to something real and not entirely made up and on the internet.
idk, communism is basically what i use to fill my god hole and its fucking hard to find communists irl and its real shitty that people from communist countries arent oftentimes communists. i just want some validation in my belief in communism by someone who is fucking real.
My Chinese parents immigrated not to US but to Canada
My mom's family got their entire business (bunch of merchant shops on the street of a rural town) and large property taken away from the communists
She's pretty anti-China and a little bigoted but hilariously enough, she's also anti-Canada/US and anti-
lolMy dad just sold t-shirts on a wagon on the streets and moved to Canada because he blew his entire life savings in his 20s travelling the entire world and wanted to live in a foreign country
He's pretty pro-China *now* because of the progress and less bigoted than my mom, but also less bigoted towards white people lol
One thing you have to remember though is that Cuba and Vietnam + China in the past were incredibly poor. Like genuinely some of the poorest and worst places you can live in on this planet. Most people are not politically literate and so of course will judge their home country based on what they've seen and experienced compared to the West rather than apply historical materialism to their opinions
One factor is that people who have the means to move to a different country have some amount of privilege (specifically money or connections) relative to the average person in their home country, even if it’s not necessarily oligarch levels of wealth
That is to say the people who are like “I came here with nothing but $10 in my pocket and created a life for myself with hard work and immigrant grindset!” might be telling the truth about arriving with such meager wealth, but are conveniently leaving out that they somehow were able to afford the thousands of dollars it costs to complete the immigration process (over a years worth of full time work in some countries), and likely have a sponsor in their destination country they could rely on for food and shelter while starting out
There's the matter of them having enough means to make it to the US, and in addition to that, they're the ones who picked the US out of anywhere in the world as where they wanted to go. It'd be like a westerner going to live in a communist country, they would not be a typical westerner.
what i do know is people that left countries during/after a revolution, for example cubans moving to florida, is because many of them were wealthy and fled to preserve their fortune/lives in some cases. as to why they do it now, i'm not too sure but i suspect a lot of it has to do with the idolization that some people in socialist countries tend to have with capitalist ones - michael parenti's blackshirts and reds has a good write-up about the latter in chapter 7. that, and the ones who have the means to leave are also probably wealthy and want to gain more wealth
My conclusion is that just because you lived in a socialist country doesnt mean youre smart or understand socialism or geopolitics. Im friends with a lot of Venezuelans none of them know what the sanctions on their country entail. I dont believe Maduro is perfect either but it sure is a one sided argument on their end. One of them is a full blown pro-usa boomer style chud. They are stupid shitheads when the socialist take over and they continue to be after the fact. Theres no magical socialism button that makes people less stupid.
selection bias?
why do the hottest water particles evaporate off first
the ones that leave and go to the US are going to be the most pro US before they left
My mom knew someone who fled Peru during the 1968 left wing coup to Francoist Spain
I live in an area with a lot of Vietnamese folks, and they are rabid anti-communists. Some of them in my neighborhood will fly the old South Vietnamese flag. One time I was eating at a restaurant one of them owns. An elderly guy walks in with a Vietnam veteran hat. The owner of the restaurant, an elderly lady, comes out and kisses the guy on the cheek and hugs him. Gives him a free meal and it was like a huge event.
It's creepy and weird. A lot of them are Catholic too which makes it even weirder.
Part of it is of course that the US supports the "egg monopoly in all of China" sort of people above all else, and those people for real hate communists because they have lost things to communism. I mean, fuck 'em, I'm glad they lost those things, but there's no mystery behind why they are chuds. I also assume there is an element of drilling refugees from communist countries in what to say, much like how DPRK refugees always seem to have the most amazing stories of cruelty to tell that never really make too much sense. I wonder how many of them would secretly like to go back if given the chance. Obviously not the actual gusanos, but the people who were just fleeing the violent effects of revolution/sanctions/intervention. They will likely be spouting the same lines, because it is the obvious path to asylum/citizenship, but how many of them would actually prefer going back?
This is a good thread
People will always have a spread of opinions, and "I really like how my country works, and I think capitalism is silly, I think I'll leave and move to the USA" seems like it's probably an uncommon train of thought.
Even if you did, it's pretty human to rationalise post-hoc that you didn't waste your life migrating to a shitty country.
Their experience of communism is not the same as your version and experience of communism. If you happen to dismiss their experience by saying it wasn’t really communism, you will get a punch in the face because for them, it was a very real, grim reality they had to go through. And the lies of capitalism are very alluring.
First of all, it isn't everyone. I know a Chinese immigrant who is awesome and one of the best communists I've ever met.
Secondly, in general it is because those are the people who left and so even if someone is leaving due to general poverty and not "Castro took my daddy's slaves", they are likely going to end up in a community of deprived slavers, so the Cuban community in America is going to just be shit. It doesn't help that the proud Cubans in America were likely to be considered spies and attacked by various means during the Cold War.
That's a specific example, but I think one can abstract from it well enough.
multiple factors: -Low cost of living -Potential market that are not yet exploited (see private sector or real estate (with loopholes) in China and Vietnam) -Social conservatism -Certain white worshipping
They’re the people who were so greedy/right wing/religious zealots/psychotic that they left and came to America. What do you expect?
The USA is the land of opportunity (to siphon dozens, hundreds, or thousands of people's paychecks into your bank account)
my fiance is great
I assume that true collectivists are less likely to immigrate.
Permanently Deleted
just having someone say to me face to face they are a communist would help me anchor my belief system to something real and not entirely made up and on the internet.
same I just sorta ran into a kenyan marxist back in high school and we are the only people keeping each other sane ever since. Its really a matter of complete fucking luck.
I actually have a couple of communist friends whose family fled a communist revolution. But the story for both was "grandpa/greatgrandpa was a colonel in the regime's army, they left with a ton of money after the revolution, also my parents and older are chuddy af".
