Skip Navigation
404 comments
  • You realize you've just redefined "liberal" to mean "socialist".

    We get to the same conclusions I realize, but I didn't redefine anything because we get there from different premises. Liberalism and socialism I would argue are ridiculously compatible views.

    Marx's favorite philosopher was Hegel and if you look at Marx's dad Heinrich

    Largely non-religious, Heinrich was a man of the Enlightenment, interested in the ideas of the philosophers Immanuel Kant and Voltaire. A classical liberal, he took part in agitation for a constitution and reforms in Prussia, which was then an absolute monarchy.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Marx

    And also given a definition where the Democrats aren't liberal, nor is anyone who supports the existence of the US or nation states in general

    Give Albert Weisbord's Conquest of Power a read.

    The fact that practically all of the settlers were poor has led to a sort of idealization in the United States of the poor and common man. In England one would fain forget his common stock; not so on this side of the Atlantic. Yet poor must not be confused with proletarians The mass of emigrants forming the basic “mother class,” a class so large that it believed no other classes existed, and thus no classes at all, was composed neither of proletarians nor of bourgeois but of petty bourgeois middle class elements, trying to find prosperity and plenty. In the Western hemisphere, the idea of class was dissolved into its matrix of mass; that is, there were masses but no classes!

    The lack of great capital and the resultant absence of clearly-defined classes in the West have given many historians the idea that democracy flourished in the West from the beginning. This is not the whole truth by any means. The West has not only given us Democracy; it has also provided us with a wholesome contempt for all government.

    It must never be forgotten that Democracy is essentially a type of State in which the people are supposed to control political affairs, either directly or through representatives. Democracy includes in its fundamental characteristics not only the right to vote and to hold office, but also a host of civil liberties in which the right of free speech, press, and assemblage are the most prominent. Now, in moving West, the tendency of the pioneer and frontiersman was to move away from all government and state laws, however mild. It was not a case of “liberalizing the law"; on the frontier the hand of the law was not to be found at all. Whatever action was necessary was effected by a posse made up directly of the people involved. There were no courts, no police, no prisons, no armed force of the State, no tax- gatherers. The original state of the frontier can best be described not as one of primitive Democracy, but as one of primitive Libertarianism.

    https://www.marxists.org/archive/weisbord/conquest2.htm

    Again, Marxism and Liberalism aren't necesarily disagreeing.

404 comments