This is no longer a safe space

Seeing the liberty hub head mod get chased out because of an honest mistake is pretty fucking disheartening. Liberty hub was one of the only places that was free of the reddit brainworms that infest almost every lemmy instance because of liberty hub's aggressive modding.

All of the people celebrating him being chased out have been banned from liberty hub for very valid reasons, whether they were very argumentative or genocide apologists. Seriously. Look up the modlog of the people actually celebrating it.

I could put up with 196's bullshit by just blocking them and hoping none of their frequent posters wandered into spaces i took part in but the fact that non-voters is still allowed to run when it's very clearly just meant to be a place to post content that's incendiary towards people who hold political beliefs that don't line up with mindgoblin's as a reaction to mindgoblin being banned from liberty hub for being incredibly argumentative is honestly pretty gross.

I'm just gonna pass mod of the comms i manage to someone i can sorta hope to handle it.

I'm too fucking old and not terminally online enough to put up with this, i'm clearly not the target demographic. Good fucking luck

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I'm sorry you feel that way. I'd like to take the chance to explain a little bit.

I've had multiple requests to ban LibertyHub from people who see strong left opinions as being trolls or inauthentic. I've refused every time, because I'm not going to remove queer folk from a queer space for genuinely held beliefs over politics that directly impact them.

The same goes for non voters. There are left wing folk who think that voting for a president that encourages genocide is the best option in the limited options available, and they think that pushing back against this president will lead to more harm than encouraging people to support him, and so, they have strong reactions to people who disagree.

Yes, the non voters community was a direct response to liberty hub, because of these two political positions. But it too, is a community run by queer folk, with genuinely held beliefs, and the space is allowed to exist only as long as it does not target specific lemmy users or communities. They can push back against political ideals they disagree with, not against the users or communities professing those ideals. Hexbear has a similar community that doesn't have this limitation, and explicitly dunks on people, not just political ideals, and that was something I wanted to avoid here.

My options are

Ban politics. This is unrealistic, and unhelpful, given how much politics is impacting our community at the moment

Enforce a particular political perspective. If I were to choose to moderate in line with my own political perspectives (which are closer to libertyhub than 196 or non voters), it would split the community even further, and fragment queer and gender diverse community on lemmy in to spaces that don't prioritise their needs. I won't have that. We're dealing with enough shit already.

Allow both groups to exist, and deal with the tension that comes from it. This is the only option that keeps the community in one piece, and able to talk about topics that are directly impacting our lives at the moment. It's also the option that creates the greatest amount of tension from day to day, but unfortunately, I don't have a solution for that.
- The obvious, the blatant, absurd obvious option, is to remove MindTraveler becase they have been doing everything in their power to harass and abuse other members of this board. Literally anyone can see that, Ada, and you just keep granting more and more freedom to this person. They've been hounding users in multiple threads, they made an entire community literally dedicated to attacking other people, and you just shrug and move on.
  
  That's the very least you should have done. There's multiple other things as well, but this is the most urgent, the most worrying and - frankly - the one that demonstrates just how incapable of dealing with conflict you are.
  
  At the end of the day, Ada never intended this instance to be explicitly in favor of any particular political view. Its a queer friendly instance first and foremost. Queer people aren't always going to agree on every political subject. Obviously the degree to which room can be made for different political views has it's limits. Fascism and conservativism clearly have no place here, for example, but that's really not what this is about.
  
  Do I think MindTraveller's behavior is abusive and inflammatory? Probably. But whether they should be banned for it isn't my decision, nor is it an easy one when from their point of view LibertyHub is causing active harm to the queer community. I don't agree with that opinion, but they should be allowed to express it in a respectful manner.
  
  I expressed a similar sentiment elsewhere in this thread about Grail.
  
  To be honest, I mostly agree with you about MindTraveller, but I think your criticism of Ada is too harsh.
  
  The obvious, the blatant, absurd obvious option, is to remove MindTraveler becase they have been doing everything in their power to harass and abuse other members of this board.
  
  Please DM me with some links, or report the content harassing other users (rather than their political beliefs)
  
  I'm not American, and I'm not active in liiberty hub, non voters or 196, so I'm not automatically across everything happening on the instance. I rely on reports and communication.
  
  I made an entire thread in this community calling them out pointing out multiple posts, which you deleted without a second thought. I'm not going to waste any more time with you or this instance. The only thing I own is to take care of Good Girl's communities.
- Ada, I disagree with being characterised as a moderate. I'm a soulist, which any terminally online politics geek can tell you is so far to the left that most people think we don't exist. I believe in voting for Biden because I'm concerned about genocide against trans people in the US and Palestinians in the West Bank, both of which a Trump presidency would guarantee. Linkopenschest is playing chicken with fascism against the DNC because he thinks principles are more important than lives, not because he's further left than me or any other member of Non Voters. I don't expect you to repeat that last part because you're committed to impartiality, but please don't call me a moderate. That's just a lie Linkopenschest made up about me.
  
  You believe marxist leninists are moderates, and that socdems are the only real communists calling for revolution.
  
  Either your politics are incomprehensible as a base or you are a fed running an op on leftist spaces.
  
  Nothing you say is to be trusted with how hard you are trying to agitate this space.
  
  It's shocking that people don't see these users as the very obvious trolls they are. People like LoC (and several other usual suspects) literally contribute nothing to any community besides agitation. If you really need a "line" that's where it is. This "radical tolerance" for obvious propaganda and information warfare is honestly disgusting, and compromise safe spaces far more than it preserves them.
  
  I will say that there are trans people on Liberty Hub who genuinely believe in not voting. And the explanation for this is very simple: The community is a suicide cult. Trump is flavor-ade and Linkopenschest has convinced the members to drink it if it means "standing up for Gaza". He's willing to die for his principles, and to take the rest of us with him.
  
  False, you're extrapolating that he'll not vote or vote for Trump based on what he says about Biden, which is completely fallacious reasoning.
  
  I frequent LibertyHub and LinkOpensChest didn't convince me of shit. I'm a whole person with very strongly held and well developed political beliefs. Just because you don't agree with those beliefs doesn't mean I'm a brainwashed slave resolved to stripping your rights and installing a fascist dictator.
  
  I've edited the post.
  
  Honestly Maga believes principles are more important than lives, and until Biden withdrew today, they were winning.
  
  The truth is politics has become so hideously compromised that almost nobody is a "great" candidate anymore, nobody is inspiring. Watching everyone close ranks against Sanders last election solidified that.
  
  I disagree with being characterised as a moderate
  
  You might disagree. But disagreeing doesn't make it true. E.g Pelosi swears she's progressive, but that's not true
  
  Man, shut up. You're so annoying to everyone here. You've caused more drama than anyone else, including the reason why LOC.wav left.
- Hey, reading through this thread alone and the drama it surround and I just wanted to say
  
  Thank You.
  
  It's clear you put a lot of time, thought and effort into moderating this instance and that you have to put up with a lot of trying things. It doesn't seem easy and I think you're doing a great job.
  
  I just wanted to make sure it isn't literally thankless.
  
  For real. Ada's always the most level headed person in the room. Exactly what we need in an admin.
  
  Thanks Ada. I'm sorry this place seems to be constantly surrounded by drama.
- If it helps, Good Girl has before said she'd leave for Hexbear months ago. Clearly she didn't.
  
  I think she's also on that instance actually, I guess she uses two accounts for federation issues
  
  She always has (to my understanding), but she said she'd stop using her blahaj and only use Hexbear due to how Blahaj was ignoring issues she felt was more important. I don't get how Hexbear is better for her, when I've had Stalinists say queers aren't considered for workers' rule, or other such things Marx himself would find odd.
- Hold up, I think I'm confused about some things. I swear I've seen stuff either directly saying "just don't vote" or at least implying it from LibertyHub and LinkOpensChest, but I'm seeing a bunch of people saying the opposite. Am I misunderstanding something?
  
  Criticizing Biden is not the same as advocating against voting. This position is something that LOC has had to defend himself on many times, and one that many don't seem to grasp. If I'm not mistaken, LOC at one point even said he'd vote for Biden when the time came. I don't think any person should have to broadcast their voting plans explicitly to avoid being the target of controversy, but here we are.
  
  It takes a nuanced position to criticize the current establishment for being (at best) complicit in genocide while still recognizing the very real danger of fascism. Many people just see the memes bashing Biden and assume no nuance behind it.
  
  There's a lot of hating on Biden for the things he's done, but, as a member of the community, I don't often see the sentiment that we shouldn't vote for him. And that's mostly in comments anyway. If I had to guess, the general view is "I'm going to vote for Biden and hate doing it".
  
  Linkopenschest is a troll who claims to be left wing, and he's a liar. He spends 5 minutes per month saying to vote for Biden, and 20 hours per month telling everyone that Biden is a horrible person who shouldn't be president. His actions speak louder than his words to those of us who recognise right wing troll tactics. The people telling you he's pro Biden are the marks he has successfully duped.
  
  Biden sucks ass and is directly supporting the genocidal actions of Israel. He is a bad person.
  
  That said, he finally helped Ukraine out again so I guess my only option is to support him since every candidate seems to be fine with gazan kids dying.

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